Help: Emmons string 8 knee levers adjustment all messed up!

[Robert Fawcett]

Folks, sorry, I messed up & need help.

I'm an inexperienced 10 string E9 player with a push-pull even newer to me than PSG overall.

I was tuning one of my two knee levers E⇨F, E⇨D#

I ended up either turning the wrong cap screw or turning a mile in the wrong direction, then lost track of what I had done and made some bad guesses.

In short the whole thing is now a mile out of adjustment and I'm just digging myself deeper, getting one lever working not the other or neither (LKR, LKL).

I have the pinned How to Tune post by my side, it’s great, but not once this much out of whack.

Please how does a putz like me get back to the start line, assuming entirely random wrong positions for the cap screws? Those levers are the only string 8 changes in my copedent.

Thank you!

[Craig A Davidson]

Back off your bottom set screw on that string until the lever does nothing. Just to be safe do the same with the top screw. Tune the string open. Then reach under the guitar and pull that raise changer finger all the way and tune at the head tuners. Then let off and tune the string open with the top set screw. Then push that finger back til it lowers all the way and tune the note with the lower screw. if it all works your levers should do what they are supposed to unless you have moved the levers. A push pull is neat in the respect you can tune all the raises and lowers without ever hooking up pedals or knee levers.

[Robert Fawcett]

Thank you, Craig, I'll give it a go!

I'm in the UK & it’s getting late, so probably after a good night's sleep...

Much appreciated,
Rob

[Gene Tani]

look into Clem Schmitz' book and DVDs on p-p tuning, for sale on ebay

[Norman Evans]

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=205028

[Robert Fawcett]

Thank you, Norman, I have had that printed out and on my wall for a year now, with another copy fixed to a clipboard

That pinned OP is wrt an instrument which is well set up but just needs minor tuning: I somehow got way beyond that.

Further down the thread there is some supplementary advice I think is probably relevant, but due to my inexperience I needed a bit of advice specific to my situation to get me started.

[Robert Fawcett]

Gene, thank you, is that 'Methodology and Practice in Pedal Steel Guitar'?

I have it and the DVDs. I consulted it but struggled to confidently apply it. Indeed I got in this specific mess doing my best to follow simpler instructions than that booklet, which is why I thought I should stop, take a breath and ask for a reality check!

I'm sure that with a couple of nudges in the right direction from the community when I'm stuck I'll start to find the booklet very valuable. I do try before I ask, but that’s how I dug myself into a hole this time <facepalm>

I *love* this instrument

[richard burton]

Be aware that if you operate the changer by hand, there is a chance that the lowering push rod will drop out of its position, I found that out the hard way

[Robert Fawcett]

Brilliant, Richard, ༺ Tʜᴀɴᴋ ʏᴏᴜ ༻

[Robert Fawcett]

OK folks, in tune, thank you! Sincerely. I can play. Big win.

⇨ BUT ⇦

My E to D# is backed right out (I could not go flatter on the drop if I needed to, now there's a tiny air gap to screw even with lever operated).

This surely is not be how I should have ended up. What have I got wrong? Please by all means just tell me which post explains it above if I am being super-unsmart, or the appropriate page in Clem's book.

I'm sorry to put you to this trouble, I promise I'm not trying to do this without thinking or to get y'all to do my thinking for me, it's more like the harder I think the more confused I get :-/

[richard burton]

If you can't go any flatter on the E to D#, that suggests to me that there is not enough slack in the E to F raise rod.

First things first, check that when you activate the 8th string raise lever, that the 8th string finger is actually touching the body of the instrument, as per my first drawing.

[Gene Tani]

link about pp tuning that people used to post a lot

https://web.archive.org/web/20130719225 ... guide.html

this is the missing graphic from that page, the lowering action (from Carter's website)

https://web.archive.org/web/20050318040 ... _lower.htm

[Robert Fawcett]

Thank you Gene & Richard, I'll look at those tomorrow, including close double checking against your drawings Richard, which are sincerely appreciated...

R