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Topic: Jerry Byrd Reponses On His Diatonic Tuning |
Jack Byrd
From:
Kalamazoo, Michigan
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Posted 23 Dec 2001 5:33 pm |
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The following are the comments from Jerry concerning the recent thread on his diatonic tuning. These are his words and not mine so keep that is mind as you proceed through this posting which will be quite long and I feel he has a lot of insight that would be helpful to the community of steel players interested in this particular tuning. So lets get started.
This tuning is very tough to play by the run of the mill player. It requires seven strings – have tried all other combinations-seven strings much the best. I am not a chord player-not a strummer. I always look for the best tuning for a song – whatever it may be. The song tells me the best tuning and sounds the best to use and has the best playing possibilities. To play the diatonic tuning restring the guitar to the right gauge strings. Guitar must be a short scale neck- 24 inch neck or more is very difficult to get slants and almost impossible in the first five frets because they are too far apart and the strings too close together. There is no way you can do a three string slant without the middle string being off. Needs to be a short scale neck 22 to 22 and 1/4 inches.
The bar required is 2 and3/4” or maybe 2 and 5/8 inches. String spacing on old single neck 6 and 7 stringers was about 3/8 inches. That is what it should be to play all these slants and get them true.
That is what always stood my playing out among all the others is that I could do things with slants that they would have to do with pedals and doing it mechanically and doing it playing is two different things –the tone, the sound, the approach all of that enters in. And that is why I never included it (diatonic tablature) in my stuff (catalog of arrangements) – The average person I know who I have given it to over the years could never figure it out – couldn’t play it at all. So it had no sale value other than somebody collecting paper.
And that is the reason I never included it in with any other stuff.
Concerning the request by several individuals wanting tab for songs in this tuning, of which I have several (6-8 songs), I am including tab for Cold Cold Heart which was the way I recorded it on the album Satin Strings of Steel. (Hopefully I can get this posted soon, JLB). I didn’t see much sense in doing a bunch of them because most people can’t play them – maybe play at them.
Next To Jimmy is the song that I used the diatonic tuning for the first time and is the song used by many as the point of reference.
Most people do not want to go to the trouble of restringing another guitar and going to seven strings. I suggest they get an eight string and leave the bottom string off. Don’t be putting another string on there just to be putting another note on because it gets in the way.
In Andy Volk’s post where he states “Yeah, you can get a lot of chords at a single fret but you need to do some wide string skipping” that is true. Every other 6, 4, 3 – 6, 4, 2 whatever. You’ve go to be an expert at blocking and muting. You’ve got to do it very subtly and quickly. Do not want to chop it off. I can say that is one of the best things that I do. That is why they couldn’t tell when I change from one thing to the other because it is so subtle that they think I played the whole passage on the same strings when I didn’t. You can’t tell where I am at by listening.
People have tried this tuning in the past and gave up on it. The problem is the very thing just described. When changing string combinations that you have to do a lot in this tuning, you got to do it to make it sound like you didn’t and that is what takes so long to learn to play it – their technique is not right. I do the same thing in other tunings. I sound like pedals if I want to – I did a whole album – Byrds Expedition- in E9th tuning basically and sounded on a lot of it like I had pedals. Guys thought I had gone to pedals and found out I didn’t then they knew I had to be doing some kind of s—t with that bar in my left hand to get all that stuff which is inside three string slants – three string reverse slants, all of that was thrown into the pot but they are hearing it but not aware of where I am on the neck when playing it and which strings I am playing it on.
In regards to Paul Graupp comments about Jerry not accepting pedals, Jerry’s response was this.
It’s not that I don’t like pedals, it’s what they are doing with them and I could do very little different because it’s a mechanical thing and you get too busy with mechanics and gadgets you forget what the h--- you should be playing and SAYING. If you don’t have something to SAY musically nobody is going to listen to you. Same as talking, if you don’t have something worth saying they are not going to listen to you. I don’t sacrifice pedals and a bunch of gadgets for a sound everybody can copy in two minutes. I went ahead and did my thing knowing they couldn’t copy it because it took bar technique to do it. And I made the right decision although I wasn’t working for years. I knew in the end it would become a ho hum thing because anything that can be done mechanically can be copied mechanically. But you can’t copy a guy’s SOUL.
Leavitt Tuning. I have tried that tuning and its all right – but it doesn’t have near the possibilities that my diatonic tuning does. It is a different thing.
As concerns Carl Dixon’s comments he is probably the most qualified to get into the fray when he talks about “Now look at strings 3, 5 and 6. You have a G Dominant 7th chord in Key of C at the same fret” and so on. I can get the same thing at two or three different positions when I play but they sound different and you get in and out of those positions differently. Carl has the mechanics down on which strings make which chords like that – but that doesn’t mean you can play. It’s how you move from one thing to the other is where it is at, and I’ve been screaming for years it’s not about the note it is what you do between them what counts. Players are finally waking up to that I think now.
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Paul Graupp
From:
Macon Ga USA
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Posted 23 Dec 2001 7:01 pm
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Jack: Thank you for posting both of the threads by Jerry. I think I will have to read them several more times in order to capture all he has said. There is a lot of good education and thinking in these and that is as it should be when you consider who is speaking.
Regards, Paul |
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Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
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Posted 24 Dec 2001 11:38 am
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Again, a really BIG heartfelt THANK YOU to JACK BYRD and JERRY BYRD for sharing this truly valuable insight into the "art" of playing the steel guitar "correctly".
I am not, will never be...anywhere close to being in the position that Jerry so rightfully occupies. However, having been taught, step by step by Jerry; for decades now, many (not all!) of his techniques are employed in my own day to day playing.
Night after night, I have witnessed the
faces of steel pickers that were in awe over something I had just played; normally, bar movements and various picking combinations.
I'm little more than a dedicated wanna-be but when you see steelers that have played for years......wanting to know how you did this or that.....it certainly substantiates what Jerry is sharing here, even at my own low level of accomplishment.
I'm so grateful to all Jerry has taught me and now, for Jack's major contributions from Jerry here on the Forum. Happy Holidays |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 25 Dec 2001 9:25 am
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| Boy, you go away for a few days and the things that show up! I'm awed to read this response. It's very generous of Jerry to share this stuff on the forum. I've listened to JB's work for years and was appreciative of his talents but I didn't really hear him. It's only recently that something clicked and I began to hear the subtle mastery even genius, of his approach to the instrument. |
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Mike Ihde
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 1 Jan 2002 9:45 pm
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I was glad to hear Jerry say the Leavitt tuning is "All right"..coming from him that's practically praising it! When I had the pleasure of studying with Jerry for 2 weeks back in '97 we spent some time discussing the Leavitt tuning and I played him some arrangements. He was intreged with the fact that you can get all the Jazz chords "without any slants" but, of course, since he's the master of slants, why would he care about a tuning that doesn't use them? I must say though, he converted me to the beauty of using slants and the way you can, as he said,"Put the hurt in it". Now a days I play the Leavitt tuning AND C6/A7...  |
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Jack Byrd
From:
Kalamazoo, Michigan
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