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Topic: Push button Boo Wah |
Keith Hilton
From:
248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 6:49 am |
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The Boo Wah effect was used on a lot of recordings in the 1950's. Most people used a Fender volume pedal that had a top that swiveled from side to side. Speedy West used a door knob he worked with the palm of his hand.
The Boo Wah seemed to fade away once pedals like the Cry Baby Wah Wah came along. In theory both devices, the Boo Wah, and the Cry Baby, do the same thing. That is change the frequency from high to low, or low to high. The Cry Baby has a inductor circuit that makes the transition sharper.
Both of the mentioned effects use foot pedals to operate the effect. I am trying to build these two effects using a push button that operates the effect, instead of a pedal. The duration of the effect in mili-seconds controlled by a control knob the user can adjust.
So instead of a complex volume pedal who's top moved from side to side, just a push button you step on that does the exact same thing. Of course with a push button you would lose some of the control of a Cry Baby pedal. With that said, being able to use a push button with a duration control may open new horizons. Anyway, that is what I am working on. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 7:32 am
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Ditto what Doug wrote.
For what it's worth, Gibson installed push buttons on many of its postwar consoles for both boo-wah and cutout. They called 'em "du-wah" and "audio cut-off" switches. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 7:53 am
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Back when steel guitars had a tone control, players would get the boo-wah effect by setting the tone to full bass, pick a chord, and quickly twist the knob to full treble, producing a WAH sound. Byrd, Kayton, Alvino, and many others were masters of this technique.
My understanding of the Speedy West button is that it was a spring loaded knob that cut out the sound. He would push it rapidly several times to create a "stutter" effect. I could be wrong, but maybe we are talking about two different effects here? A change in Tone - and a cut-out switch. In any event, it sounds like Keith is working on a tone change button and I'm all for that! 
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John McClung
From:
Olympia WA, USA
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 8:01 am
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Cool idea, Keith!!!!
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Jeff Mead
From:
London, England
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 10:53 am
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| Doug Beaumier wrote: |
My understanding of the Speedy West button is that it was a spring loaded knob that cut out the sound. He would push it rapidly several times to create a "stutter" effect. |
As far as I am aware, the stutter button was an attempt to try to reproduce the effect that Speedy got by slamming the bar rapidly on the strings. I don't believe Speedy ever used a cutout switch to achieve this effect.
Last edited by Jeff Mead on 3 Jul 2018 11:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Jeff Mead
From:
London, England
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 10:59 am Re: Push button Boo Wah
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| Keith Hilton wrote: |
The Boo Wah effect was used on a lot of recordings in the 1950's. Most people used a Fender volume pedal that had a top that swiveled from side to side. Speedy West used a door knob he worked with the palm of his hand.
The Boo Wah seemed to fade away once pedals like the Cry Baby Wah Wah came along. In theory both devices, the Boo Wah, and the Cry Baby, do the same thing. That is change the frequency from high to low, or low to high. The Cry Baby has a inductor circuit that makes the transition sharper.
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I'd love to try out a push button effect as you described. The huge difference between the Fender vol/tone pedal (and the bigsby and DeArmond of course) and the Cry Baby is that the former is a completely passive control - a simple tone cut - whereas the latter is an active tone boost sweep.
Very different sounds.
The main problem I have with the passive pedal is that it is very dependent on the amp and whatever else is in the chain. Sometimes it has a much less dramatic effect than others. For example, if it is used in conjunction with a Matchbox or similar, it has no effect at all (so I don't use it on pedal steel gigs).
If your pedal replicated the sound of the analogue pedal it would be great as long as there was some sort of sweep between the two sounds - not just an on/off. However if replicating a Cry Baby, I wouldn't be interested. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 11:21 am
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Ah, yes... we can clearly see what Speedy is doing in this video, 0:53 into the video:
----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L22emPmRh_Y&t=0m53s
He reaches over and spins the knob to full bass, then he hammers the bar down on the strings and quickly spins the knob to full treble. So it IS a side mounted tone control, not a stutter (cut) switch. Speedy always got plenty of stutter (bar chatter) by bouncing the bar on the strings.
So any boo-wah button would have to first activate full bass and then return to the normal treble position... either automatically or the player would have to do it manually. In other words, the tone position for normal playing is not full bass, but the boo-wah starts with full bass and quickly goes to treble.
_________________
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25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel |
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Keith Hilton
From:
248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 4:00 pm
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Doug, that was a wild you tube video of Speedy. When I was 7 years old I took lap steel lessons from a Mrs. Crebbs. Mrs. Crebbs had a little music store in Springfield, Missouri, and was a Fender dealer. She had big pictures of Speedy West hung all over her store. She bragged that she had taught Speedy how to play. Many years later I ask Speedy about Mrs. Crebbs, and he confirmed her story.
I got to where I hated going to my lap steel lessons. When I would try to play my homework assignment for Mrs. Crebbs--and would hit a wrong note--she would whack my fingers with a big long pencil. I eventually talked my parents into letting me quit my lap steel lessons. Shortly after that my cousin showed me how to play a simple version of "Steel Guitar Rag". I took my lap steel to my grade school and played "Steel Guitar Rag." Walking home from school with my lap steel under one arm I felt 10 feet tall. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Rick Contino
From:
Brattleboro, Vermont
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 6:04 pm
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Keith:
Would it be possible to have a spring loaded push button that “boohs “ when pressed and “wah s†when released?
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Shobud "The Professional" D-10, Stage One S-10, National "New Yorker," NV400 |
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Clyde Mattocks
From:
Kinston, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 3 Jul 2018 7:16 pm
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There were stutter buttons and boo wah buttons on steels in the 50s. My teacher Kenny Dail had both on his triple neck fender. He had a radio/TV tech install them.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro |
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Joe Burke
From:
Toronto, Canada
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Posted 4 Jul 2018 6:04 am
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Love the Boo-Wah!
Anyone know what tuning Speedy was using?
Rose Sinclair does some great bar slamming and Boo-Wah! I'll post a clip if I can find it. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 4 Jul 2018 6:48 am Re: Push button Boo Wah
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| Keith Hilton wrote: |
| I am trying to build these two effects using a push button that operates the effect, instead of a pedal. |
I would buy one. Bet you'd sell a boatload of 'em, Keith. Keep up the good work. |
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Bill Sinclair
From:
Waynesboro, PA, USA
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Posted 4 Jul 2018 6:53 am
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| Rick Contino wrote: |
Keith:
Would it be possible to have a spring loaded push button that “boohs “ when pressed and “wah s†when released? |
That's what I was thinking before I got to your post and I'll bet that's where Keith is headed. Maybe just a cap that sucks out the highs when you push the momentary switch and gives them back when you release it? (Probably not that simple). One problem I've had when attempting boo-wah is getting my tone knob back to its sweet spot when I'm done. I have yet to attempt it playing live. A button might solve that. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 4 Jul 2018 8:10 am
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The Boo Wah sound in my experience is made by the relationship between right hand ,left hand and tone control all working together. Every Boo Wah sound is a little different and has expressive qualities made by coordinated physical movements. I'm having a hard time seeing how a button would do that. If it could be done Keith Hilton would be the guy who could figure it out though.
The stutter button sound and bar crashing sounds that Speedy used are two different things to my ear. I spent a long time working on that stuff when I toured with Hancock.
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Bob |
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jay thompson
From:
east peoria, il USA
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Posted 4 Jul 2018 8:40 am Push button Boo Wah
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| I first met Scotty in 1959, he was teaching for Ace Nash Music , a Fender dealer. Scotty had a new white Fender 1000 on which he had mounted a momentary contact switch on the changer end of the frame. If I remember correctly, The switch was wired to short across the tone control which allowed for the fast staccato effect. The slower Boo Wah could be accomplished by using the palm of the hand rotating the tone control knob. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 5 Jul 2018 1:47 pm
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There used to be someone on the forum that made a little doo-wah/stutter combo effect. It would plug into the output jack on the side of your steel and had a red button for the cut effect and a black button for the doo-wah effect. It worked ok but it was pretty noisy.
I had an engineer friend of mine design a boo-wah effect that we installed in place of the tone control on my Fender steel guitar. It also worked pretty well but we could never get all the noise out. It basically did the same thing as a boo-wah pedal. It cut the highs when engaged and let them back in when released. I use the effect at 2:15 of this clip:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8BN2xJM-Lo
Last edited by Tim Whitlock on 6 Jul 2018 5:38 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Clyde Mattocks
From:
Kinston, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 5 Jul 2018 3:14 pm
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That's that good ol' rich Fender tone Tim, even when you're not doing an effect. Nice!
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro |
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