need help with MSA psg replacement pu

Anthony Vandewalle · Post by **Anthony Vandewalle** » 7 May 2005 11:27 pm

I have a solid maple body D10 MSA Classic
XL (Supersustain Roman numeral 2 decal on necks)with Supersustain (not Roman numeral 2)humbuckers. I would like to try different pu's and from my research on the Forum George L E66 and Jerry Wallace Truetone pu's appear to be the most popular replacements. I would very much appreciate hearing from Forum members who have experience with MSA replacement pu's on the following questions:
1.Tonally, which pu is the best? I realise that this is a rather subjective question but I'm really looking for some comfort that either pu is a significant improvement on the rather muddy sounding (to my ear)Supersustains
2.The Supersustains each measure 1.75x4 ins and appear to be mounted on a separate suport plate which in turn is spring-mounted to the aluminium pu housing by way of 3 tabs, 2 at the changer end and one at the tuner end. How is the pu attached to the sprung support plate?
3.Will either the George L or the Truetone fit on the pu support plate without the need to modify the pu cavity?
4.What impedance should the new pu have?
5.Message for Mr Reece Anderson. Reece, if you happen to read this I would appreciate it if you could provide any historical information on my MSA, serial # 2C 5830. By the way, being an engineer, I really appreciate the MSA engineering

Bob Carlucci · Post by **Bob Carlucci** » 8 May 2005 3:15 am

Anthony.. I agree on the SS humbuckers.. Here area few ideas.. I took the SS humbucker out and had it modified so I could split the coils.. It gave me 3 tonal options.. front coil, rear coil, both coils.. It worked out perfectly for me,and looked factory,but you will neeed a good pickup rewinder who is willing to do that kind of work... They are hard to find...

The MSA mounting pocket cutout will give problems, because they are somewhat narrower than most replacemant pickups. Some guys have them machined,but I wouldn't if I can help it.
Jerry Wallace DOES make an MSA replacement, but it does not fit the MSA brackets.. It is set in silicone adhesive.. Don't worry, it works fine!!..Also, talk to Jerry about the sound YOU want and Jerry will wind your pickup for THAT sound. DON'T go with too heavy a winding.. I have mine wound lightly and i love the tone!!. Jerry can wind you one with a coil tap so you can get two different windings out of the pickup also, thats what I have on my Carter.. It works great!!
Please contact JERRY Wallace ,he will take good care of that pickup problem for you.. He is the FIRST guy to talk to with MSA replacement pickup questions... There will be other MSA players show up on this thread that have done different things to solve thier SS humbucker "problem", and I'm sure they'll have some great ideas, but Jerry Wallace makes excellent pickups,and is the 'go to' guy for MSA steel guitar pickups IMHO. You are correct about MSA engineering... 20 years ahead of its time.. I think it is second to none.. Your MSA will play as good as it did when it left the factory,and will do so until you can no longer play it.. www.jerrywallacemusic.com bob[This message was edited by Bob Carlucci on 08 May 2005 at 04:22 AM.]

Reece Anderson · Post by **Reece Anderson** » 8 May 2005 3:47 am

Anthony....Thank you for being an MSA owner.

Serial number 2C-5830 shows to be a clear double 10 XL which left the factory with 8 pedals and 4 knee levers. It was orginally shipped to Dell View Music in San Antonio Texas.

The specific date of manufacture was not entered into record, however records indicate it as being born in October of 1977.

I appreciate your very flattering comments concerning your MSA.

Bob....Thank you as well for your kind words about MSA.

Jeff A. Smith · Post by **Jeff A. Smith** » 8 May 2005 11:04 pm

3.Will either the George L or the Truetone fit on the pu support plate without the need to modify the pu cavity?

An E-66 fit nicely into the aluminum pocket on my '76 Classic. When I went to a True Tone, I just asked Jerry to make sure the single coil's dimensions weren't larger than the E-66, and he cheerfully complied. I don't know about the standard size True Tones and the aluminum pocket...

Anthony Vandewalle · Post by **Anthony Vandewalle** » 9 May 2005 3:51 am

Bob....Thanks for your ideas and recommendations

Reece....Thank you for taking the trouble to unearth my MSA's history

Jeff....Good information, thanks. Could you please compare the performance of the E66 and TT versus the SS pups as you saw it. Also, what resitance was the TT wound to?

Anthony Vandewalle · Post by **Anthony Vandewalle** » 9 May 2005 4:10 pm

Bump please

Jeff A. Smith · Post by **Jeff A. Smith** » 9 May 2005 8:03 pm

Jeff....Good information, thanks. Could you please compare the performance of the E66 and TT versus the SS pups as you saw it. Also, what resitance was the TT wound to?

The TT is wound to about 17.5. I'll just paste a post I did from June of 2003, which still pretty much says it all for me. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>July 16, 2003

Jerry Wallace told me that he personally prefers 17.5 to 18K for tone. Not really knowing much about the subject, I decided to go along with his stock recommendation when I got a True Tone to replace an E-66 on my '76 MSA S-10.
After having had it a few weeks, I still strongly feel that overall, I made the right choice. On my guitar, with the way I play, the E-66 sounded great on country-type licks in the high and high-mid register. However, I felt it significantly lacked in other areas.
The True Tone has more than enough body, the highs are thicker and more sweet, and there is an improvement in clarity and string separation. I'll admit that sometimes I miss that classic E-66 country soul on certain licks, but I can still increase my treble on the amp to get in the same range with the True Tone. There are so many plusses to the new pickup, that it's well worth the trade off. The bit of single-coil hum isn't a problem for me, but I'll admit I haven't had it out of the house yet.
As far as winding for more bass than Jerry's stock resistance, I don't know what to say. I know that I don't feel the need for any more bass, and I'd probably miss the clear highs I now have -- particularly since I have an MSA.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I'm going to also give you a post of mine from just a few weeks ago, which highlights a certain problem I had with the E-66. I don't suggest that others have had this problem, but I will say that, as far as I can see, my lacquer '76 MSA Classic is a nice one, with no visible things that would cause this problem: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>The E-66 is supposed to be a really good match with older MSA's in general, and putting one on my '76 S-10 Classic was definitely an improvement over the old Supersustain. However, I found that I had to tilt the pickup forward (toward the keyhead)to get a sound I even liked. If the E-66 was level to the strings, there was a disagreeable midrange. This was the same no matter what amp I used, so it was a limitation I had to deal with.
I suppose that may have just been my particular guitar, or even my personal taste to a degree.
Anyway, the True Tone provided a much more full-bodied sound, more agreeable in most respects than the E-66. Very sweet and liquid-sounding. YMMV.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Yep Anthony, I've ended up being kind of a shill for Jerry's pickups on MSA's.

[This message was edited by Jeff A. Smith on 09 May 2005 at 09:05 PM.]