Pickups on your dobro

Dirk B · Post by **Dirk B** » 20 Sep 2001 5:21 am

I tried one of those McIntyre transducers for my cheapie Regal dobro. I mounted it where they suggested (at the south end of the spider toward the endpin jack) and it sounded like a tin can in an echo-chamber. After moving it toward the center of the spider, the tone is improved, but it still isn't great and feeds back at the drop of a hat, with the slightest increase in volume; and both the tone controls on my amp have to be turned to 0!

I would like to hear about others' experiences. Does anyone else have suggestions? Do I need to have an internal pickup professionally installed?

Howard Parker · Post by **Howard Parker** » 20 Sep 2001 7:44 am

I'm using one and it sounds great. What kind of spider do you have on that Regal? How did you attach the pickup?

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Howard Parker
poobah@resoguit.com
www.resoguit.com
ListOwner RESOGUIT

Dirk B · Post by **Dirk B** » 20 Sep 2001 10:56 am

Don't know a lot about dobros but it's an aluminum spider; the pickup is attached beneath it with the black "bubblebum" they supply with it.

Does yours sound like a dobro going through a mike (i.e. an acoustic dobro but louder)? Mine definitely has an "artificial" tone to it and picks up the slighest sounds, like pick noise, in the extreme; which explains the feedback at low volumes, I guess.

Howard Parker · Post by **Howard Parker** » 20 Sep 2001 12:03 pm

Dirk...

Mine sounds very natural. I _do_ drive it through a Fishman Blender (preamp) to shape the tone a bit. I may be wrong, but, I thought the pre was recommended.

Also...If you are going to drive the volume to club levels I'd recommend some type feedback eliminator. I'm using the Sabine Solo (something or other).

You might be able to get assistance from Paul Beard Guitars/Resophonic Outfitters..301-733-8271 They did the complete install for me.

Hope this helps.

h

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Howard Parker
poobah@resoguit.com
www.resoguit.com
ListOwner RESOGUIT

Tim Rowley · Post by **Tim Rowley** » 20 Sep 2001 11:14 pm

Ditto what Howard Parker said. Except I haven't yet had the need for a preamp. I run my McIntyre-equipped no-name dobro through a variety of amps but I seem to get the best tone out of my Session 500 or (believe it or not) my little Bandit 112. Both of these amps give a more natural and transparent tone than the Nashville 400 for some reason.

If close quarters causes a feedback tendency, I back the amp down and mike or line it to the soundboard. On a bigger stage it doesn't feed back even at fairly high volumes. I say that, of course I can force it to feed back at outrageous volume levels, same as many acoustic/electric guitars will. Anyway, as to amp settings, I set the bass control near max, the mids at about 4, the treble at 0 or 1, the shift about 4 (variable), and don't run my presence over 5. If I use any reverb at all I keep it around 2 or 3 at most.

Just a suggestion: take a good look at your installation and make sure that the cable isn't touching the cone nor cover plate anywhere, that the center screw on the cone is adjusted properly, that the spider is sitting perfectly level and square (I had to level mine and dress it with a file), and that the hole where the cable angles thru the top of the soundwell is properly sealed. Some installers tightly tie-strap the transducer cable to the leg of the spider to prevent it from transmitting any bad harmonic resonances back to the transducer.

What kind of amp are you using? I'd try a different amplifier, it seems weird in my experience that your tone controls have to be set at 0. The treble maybe, the bass no way. And be sure to keep your master volume significantly hotter than your pregain control. The one thing that will not work with a transducer-equipped dobro is any semblence of overdrive because the clipped wave forms seem to excite the feedback tendencies of the transducer. Oh yes, one more thing: use a good cable, not over about 18' in length for capacitance sake.

I hope that one of these suggestions is helpful in solving the feedback and tone problems for you. The McIntyre is a good unit, but since any chain is only as strong as its weakest link, the goal is to find the weak link and fix it. If nothing solves the problem, it IS possible that you got a bad transducer and if so the music store should replace it.

Good luck Dirk,

Tim R.

David Stehman · Post by **David Stehman** » 21 Sep 2001 1:12 am

Dirk, What Howard and Tim said. Using Reed with older and newer Mac's for stereo blending. Using the preamp helps a LOT. RLBaggs here. Both good. presence at 3 oclock/other 4 eq's flat at 12/gain at 12(50%) To California Blonde flat,rev/2,gain at 2,master vol 12-3 as needed. Or, to Peavey KB100 to "Amp In." 0 FB if at least 3'away, and not showing face/back of guitar to speaker. New Feather less fb prone.
let us know.
David stehman

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 21 Sep 2001 2:42 am

* [This message was edited by Gene Jones on 06 May 2002 at 09:04 AM.]

Dirk B · Post by **Dirk B** » 21 Sep 2001 5:25 am

Great -- I'll try those suggestions. Many thanks to all,
Dirk

Ted Smith · Post by **Ted Smith** » 22 Sep 2001 8:36 am

I've spent some time with Carl on this and the black "bubble gum" is critical to the tone. BE SURE and use it all and barely push it on the putty until it sticks, the more putty between the pickup and the spider the better. Carl also had me use the Centaur Acoustic PA amp, and it did make a difference in a true-'er tone.

I believe this is one of the biggest lacking areas in reso guitars and have put a lot of time into solving it - can't say it's done yet.

Ted Smith · Post by **Ted Smith** » 2 Oct 2001 7:52 am

I discussed this forum post with the McIntyres today and this new "Feather" pickup is very interesting in the ideas he has on the feed back elimination. He believes mounting under the cone with this device is taking at least half of the feed back problems out. Only been out since March and he states every one of the pros with the older model are happier with the Feather. [This message was edited by Ted Smith on 02 October 2001 at 08:54 AM.]

Kevin Post · Post by **Kevin Post** » 7 Oct 2001 11:43 am

I had no luck with the McIntyre Pickups on my D60. I use a Shure Beta 98 ($200) mic in tandem with a Lace Sensor($80). I run these into a 2 channel mixer (has phantom power). Then into a Boss pedal tuner (has a mute function). I get no feedback with a very realistic, fat sound. I play on the road with Terri Clark on huge PA's. It never gives me trouble.

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 8 Oct 2001 2:02 pm

Kevin-which 2-channel mixer are you using?

Ted Smith · Post by **Ted Smith** » 9 Oct 2001 7:37 am

We have a body in the molds that will give us the ability to access the inside at the time the instrument is being played - to test everything we can.
We have a half dozen manufacturers sending pickups for the test ranging from new acoustic mic.s to a new Lace pickup. I am going to video tape the results as we do them so you can hear some of the tonal differences and maybe - maybe find a better standard in this problem.

Aaron Balano · Post by **Aaron Balano** » 10 Oct 2001 2:06 pm

I have been told by both Tim Scheerhorn and Larry Cragg (Neil Young's excellent guitar technician and superb steel player) that to achieve the best sound out of the mcintyre pick-ups, the placement on the spider is crucial. If the p/u is placed incorrectly, the sound sucks (it's not that great to begin with). There is also a need to run some sort of microphone signal at the same time as the p/u and blend the two through a preamp. I use a Rane preamp w/an eq for both channels and get a great sound. The best sound I have heard comes from the preamp and goes straight to the pa. A regular amp (even an acoustic guitar amp) colors the sound too much and what comes out sounds terrible.
Aaron

Chris Schlotzhauer · Post by **Chris Schlotzhauer** » 11 Oct 2001 7:02 am

OK, so what's the proper placement on the spyder? If the instructions that come with the Mac aren't correct, what is? I've seen posts here about the amount of "bubble gum" between the pickup and spyder is crutial. I've seen posts about the location on the spyder is crutial. The instructions from the mfr clearly show the spot they recommend.
I just re-set up my Dobro with a new Q-man cone, I filed and leveled the spyder, re-installed the Mac pickup, then re-assembled everything. It sounds awsome acousticly. And to my amazement, zero buzzes or rattles. The Mac pickup, however, still sounds like crap. So, I'm a little leary to screw around with the sound I have by disassembling the Dobro, re-assembling after I tweek the Mac only to do it all again, trying to get the Mac to sound good. Every time you take the Dobro apart, you run the risk of buzzes and rattles. Obviously, my frustration with the Mac shows. And what frustrates me more, is when I see other posts raving abou the Mac. What am I missing? And why doesn't the manufacturer support or recommend ANY of the ideas I have read on this forum? So...once and for all, the proper way to install a Mac is....................?

Kevin Post · Post by **Kevin Post** » 11 Oct 2001 1:21 pm

Chas,It's a Phonic mixer ($80). It's about the size of a large guitar pedal, like a Memory Man. I think it actually has six inputs, but just two have phantom power. It's limited, but the sound guys love the tone from it.

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 11 Oct 2001 3:05 pm

Kevin, thank you, limited is good, I have enough 'boxes' that come with manuals the size of phone books that do too many things, a lot of which I don't understand, which in turn makes me feel stupid and ignorant and when I think about how much I just spent to feel that way, it makes me feel more so.

David Stehman · Post by **David Stehman** » 13 Oct 2001 11:20 am

Ted you're da man on the research. Thanks so
much for testing transducers on resos! This has been a project in the works for years.
Best to you. Will your accessible reso body be suitable for performance outside the lab,
or strictly a research platform. Just thinking how neat it would be to tinker and test without the usual disassembly/reassembly.
I'm ready to electrify my Melobro and value your reccomendadtions.
David Stehman

Sage · Post by **Sage** » 13 Oct 2001 1:14 pm

Yes, great idea Ted.
Chris, I just got a new feather and I do like it a lot. As with all of these, placement is everything. With a feather, you can probably just stick it different places on the inside of the cone until you find a spot that you like, then go inside the guitar and do the work of mounting it. I don't know if it would be so easy in practice (havent done it that way yet) but it does have the potential to be moved a few times without loosing all adhesion (this I've tried). Your milage may vary.
T. Sage Harmos

Dirk B · Post by **Dirk B** » 16 Oct 2001 6:08 am

I just received my new StewMac catalogue and they're featuring the feather now; I couldn't even find the transducer I mentioned in the open of this post. I guess that answers my original question about the problems with it -- good to hear I wasn't alone.

Kevin Post · Post by **Kevin Post** » 16 Oct 2001 7:04 am

I played a Beard guitar with a feather pickup at Namm a few months ago. It was pretty damn great. It doesn't beat a mic/magnetic pickup combination, though. It is simpler to use, and it does sound pretty good.