The Steel Guitar Forum

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 28 Mar 2005 11:18 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>LKL that raises the Es and and a
LKR that lowers them<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>That's the most common setup.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 28 Mar 2005 11:20 am

well I'm a complete hack but here is my take..and I'll spare which lever they should be on..but they should be underneath the guitar for the most part...

4+8 raise
4+8 lower
2nd 1/2 step lower
2nd full tone lower
1st full tone raise
2nd 1/2 step raise
9th 1/2 step lower
7th whole tone raise
6th 1/2 step lower
5 and 10- 1/2 step lower

boy, thats a bunch.....no wonder we all have bad knees!

t

ps..I think you are right..there is no standard..and I doubt the folks on our forum here can arrive at a consensus on anything !
( me included)[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 28 March 2005 at 11:23 AM.]

Charles Turpin · Post by **Charles Turpin** » 28 Mar 2005 11:51 am

Tony i was just a wondering you have the whole tone raise on the 7th string. I have that one too. Do you use it very often i am thinking about dropping it to a 1/2 tone raiose cause it seems i use it more like that than i do as a full tone. But it does make some pretty melodies when using the a and B pedals making a Major seventh all the way across the neck with the 2nd string a half step raise and the first string a whole tone raise on the same knee lever.

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Larry Hamilton · Post by **Larry Hamilton** » 28 Mar 2005 12:05 pm

John, You can set your new guitar up the way you want it or you can have someone do it for you. There are the more standard knee levers and their positions but you ultimately can put them where you want. I have been doing some experimenting here recently. Some changes I like and keep and some I don't and go back to what I had. Hope this helps a little, good luck.

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Keep pickin', Larry

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 28 Mar 2005 12:20 pm

Charles, I have been using the 7th string raise as more of an additional note in the scale rather than chord building.

Down there in the 3rd fret land and first fret land this makes for a very deep full step bend up as I call it..once you get to the 5th fret redundancy sets in but the timbre of playing off of the 7th string is a bit different.

The 2nd string raise is also becoming a favorite of mine and also in the same sense , as an additional note in the scale rather than chord structures although you can grab some nice triads with 1,2 raise along with 5 and or 7..or even 8 starting with the lower on 8..( 8 lower, 1+2 natural then 8 natural 1+2 raise)

just a few more options on getting back to the root from 5( oops..there goes those numbers again)

boy this is getting nuts...

but keep in mind I'm just a hack..

t

[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 28 March 2005 at 12:22 PM.]

Roger Edgington · Post by **Roger Edgington** » 28 Mar 2005 6:43 pm

Charles
I have 7th raise half tone and whole tone. I don't use the whole tone near as often as the half. I have the half on the same lever as the 2nd and 9th lower. I do use it a lot. I don't play it with 2nd and 9th strings,but rather with A and B pedals. The whole raise is with the 1st string whole raise.

David Wren · Post by **David Wren** » 29 Mar 2005 8:24 am

I see most of my changes here. I lower the 7th (F#) 1/2 tone... can make for a very fluid decending scale while letting other notes in the triad ring. I play a U12 now, but even when I had a D10 I never kept the D string, so I also lower the 8th (E) a full tone to D... very nice holding this while vamping with the B pedal down/up down/up. Result can be a real cool 7th rythmic backup. As far as I'm concerned standards are OK, but don't be afraid to try new setups.

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Dave-'95CarterS12_E9/B6_7X7-Session500-Wren

Grant Johnson · Post by **Grant Johnson** » 29 Mar 2005 9:45 am

There are many vaiations on this subject...
I bought a PSG a couple years ago with the E&F pulls on the right leg. I kept them there as I found that there were a couple moves that were easier to me. My new PSG has them on the left leg and I am debating what to do... More people use the left leg as the standard, but for me those pulls work better on the right leg...
One knee lever pull that I cannot do with out is raising string one a half step and lowering string two a half step. I really like the Bakersfield (Brumley, Mooney, Hamlett, Red Rhodes etc)sound. When I am in AB pedals down I use those pulls for many passing notes....

Doug Seymour · Post by **Doug Seymour** » 29 Mar 2005 2:41 pm

I wouldn't buy a "pro" steel that couldn't be set up any way you wanted it! Today's steels are not "welded" at the factory like they were when Buddy & Jimmy were playing Shot's steels! Bobby Lee (b0b) & I have our own reasons for having the Es raising on LKL & lowering on RKR. I wouldn't have it any other way on the E9th! (But that's just silly old steel picker me!)[This message was edited by Doug Seymour on 29 March 2005 at 02:45 PM.]

Ernie Pollock · Post by **Ernie Pollock** » 31 Mar 2005 4:59 am

I think the standard is, as with about everything else with steel guitar, there is no standard!!

Ernie Pollock

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Per Berner · Post by **Per Berner** » 31 Mar 2005 6:06 am

Why have the E raises and lowers on different knees?

As you would never be using them together, it must make more sense having them on the same knee - or am I missing something?

Enlighten me, please!
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´75 Emmons p/p D10 8+4, '96 Emmons Legrande II D10 8+5, ´76 Sho-Bud Pro III Custom SD10 4+5, Peavey Nashville 1000

Dean Parks · Post by **Dean Parks** » 31 Mar 2005 6:44 am

Per-

Lloyd Green video clip

Look at this clip of Lloyd Green (posted by Bill Fuentes a couple of days ago). On the last chord, Lloyd is in the "AF" position, and moves the 8th string lowered E to the raised E. He does this smoothly because of the separate knees.

Paul Franklin talks about this advantage in several posts in the Forum archives.

ps- I got this clip to play by changing the tag on the downloaded RealAudio file from ".rm" to ".ram", then double-clicking the file to play.

-dean-[This message was edited by Dean Parks on 31 March 2005 at 06:45 AM.][This message was edited by Dean Parks on 31 March 2005 at 06:48 AM.][This message was edited by Dean Parks on 31 March 2005 at 06:50 AM.][This message was edited by Dean Parks on 31 March 2005 at 06:51 AM.][This message was edited by Dean Parks on 31 March 2005 at 06:54 AM.]

Per Berner · Post by **Per Berner** » 31 Mar 2005 7:09 am

Dean, I see your point, there may be some advantage. But I've been playing Lloyd's "Summer clouds" for decades (which contains a move just like that) without any trouble making the transition smooth.

I have a high E to F# raise on my LKV, so it makes logical sense to me having all three E-string levers on the left knee. Less risk of mixing things up, IMO.

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´75 Emmons p/p D10 8+4, '96 Emmons Legrande II D10 8+5, ´76 Sho-Bud Pro III Custom SD10 4+5, Peavey Nashville 1000