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Topic: Marlen S-10 Pull Relese |
Larry Moore
From:
Hampton, Ga. USA
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Posted 20 Jan 2017 12:14 am |
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Trying to help a friend with this Marlen S-10 3-3.
I have two Emmons PP's. do they tuned the same way the PP's tune?
Cannot get the Knee levers to tune correct.
Pedals and open tuning seem to be working Ok.
Need a little Tech support.
Also Can anyone help date this Steel S/N 047791
Thanks for any help
Larry |
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Ned McIntosh
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 20 Jan 2017 4:38 am
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Serial number indicates 4th guitar made in 1977.
Tuning requires you to access all ends of the steel:-
To tune a raise:-
Activate raise via pedal or lever and tune raised note at tuning-key. Release pedal and (if there is no lower), tune open-note at the stop-screws in the threaded holes at the top of the end-plate. Check each note and repeat until both are true.
To tune a lower:-
For a lower, first tune the open-note at the tuning-key, then activate the lower and tune the lower at the stop-screw at the endplate. Check the open-note and lower until both are true.
To tune a strng with both a raise and a lower:-
First tune the raise at the tuning-key with the raise activated, then activate the lower and tune it at the stop-screws in the end-plate.
Then, release the lower and tune the open-note using the stop-collars or tuning-nut (whichever you have) on the end of the pull-rod inside the open window in the end-plate.
Repeat all three processes until all three notes are true.
Strings with a raise and a lower MUST be properly set-up, and each adjustment affects the other two so you have to go through a few iterations of the process to get all three notes just right.
With pull-release you are balancing string-tension against spring-tension. Strings with both a raise and a lower will have a tension-rod and a spring anchored to the cabinet somewhere to help them achieve the open-note by balancing the opposing tensions. On that tension-rod at the lowering bellcrank there will be a small stop-collar with a tab. The tab stops the pull-rod rotating when the tuning-nut is used (otherwise the tuning-nut won't advance or retreat along the thread). The lowering-bellcrank pushes against the stop-collar to overcome spring-tension holding the tension-rod in the correct position for the open-note and allows the lower to take place. Make sure the stop-collar is correctly positioned to give a full "push" for the lower. Adjust the pedal or lever stop-screw under the cabinet so there is enough "push" to complete the lower. Once you have this, the screws in the end-plate will tune the lower just fine.
Some advice, if I may: Pull-rods must not rub against cross-shafts, each other or bellcranks. Friction is the arch-enemy of pull-release. Also, if your pull-rods are threaded on the end for tuning-nuts, make sure no part of the threaded-section is inside the hole in the changer-finger - that will cause you a lot of frustration if it happens!
Make sure the roller-nuts all rotate freely, and lubricate the changer-fingers where they meet the changer-axle. Ideally, when a raise is fully-activated, the changer-finger will actually contact the body of the cabinet for optimum sound-transfer (same as an Emmons p-p).
In most respects it's very similar to a p-p Emmons, but sometimes a knee-lever, especially a lower, might have to be tuned initially by adjusting the knee-lever stop-screw under the guitar to ensure the changer-finger moves back far enough to complete the lower and to go slightly flatter than desired. Then tune it as above with the end-plate screws.
Once set up and tuned, these steels have legendary tuning stability, but make sure you always use the same gauge strings!
Also, be sure to tune with the guitar upright on its legs in the playing-position. The rods may hang slightly differently if it is in the case upside-down, and even that can effect tuning.
_________________
The steel guitar is a hard mistress. She will obsess you, bemuse and bewitch you. She will dash your hopes on what seems to be whim, only to tease you into renewing the relationship once more so she can do it to you all over again...and yet, if you somehow manage to touch her in that certain magic way, she will yield up a sound which has so much soul, raw emotion and heartfelt depth to it that she will pierce you to the very core of your being. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 20 Jan 2017 9:22 am
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While I don't mean this to contradict Ned, who is a master at working on pull-release (go on, Ned, show the underside of yours), I describe the process differently, but it's just a different way of saying the same thing (this description lists them in order of the physics, but the order of tuning is different):
1) the highest note on a string tunes at the keyhead, whether that's open or with a pedal)
2) the lowest note, if it's not also the highest (like the 7th or 9th) tunes with those screws above the window.
3) if a string both raises and lowers, the open note tunes in the window
4) if an F lever is one of your three, you'll notice that the 4th string F lever doesn't show up in this description. In all likelihood, this pull shares a rod with the C pedal, and this note will be the last one you tune, and there will be a half-tone tuner there (like the push-pull Emmons.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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memphislim
From:
Austin, Texas
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Posted 20 Jan 2017 9:47 am
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I repair/rebuild Marlens as well as all other steels. I have 4 Marlens-3 pull release. It may be easier to talk you through this over the phone. Please feel free to call.
Slim
714-717-7218 |
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Larry Moore
From:
Hampton, Ga. USA
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Posted 21 Jan 2017 1:55 pm Marlen S-10 Pull Relese
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Thanks Ned & Lane I got it working with all pedals & Knee's.
I would like to add a Knee. There is a cross shaft but no Bellcranks. any Ideas
See #3 pic of the under carriage the empty cross shaft
Larry
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 21 Jan 2017 2:59 pm
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I'd talk to Bob Simmons, since he's making pro model pull-release guitars. But I don't know if the shafts are the same size
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 21 Jan 2017 3:45 pm
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MSA style bellcranks will work.. same shaft size as the pull release marlen... There's a guy in Virginia or NC that worked for Marlen, and has some parts... Nice guy, forgot his name, but some here do know him... btw, to get that crosshaft out to install bellcranks, you need to loosen that entire frame and pull it away from the body to gain clearance.. they are a pain to work on.... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 21 Jan 2017 3:46 pm
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MSA style bellcranks will work.. same shaft size as the pull release marlen... There's a guy in Virginia or NC that worked for Marlen, and has some parts... Nice guy, forgot his name, but some here do know him... btw, to get that crosshaft out to install bellcranks, you need to loosen that entire frame and pull it away from the body to gain clearance.. they are a pain to work on.... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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