That Dang Ninth String... Revisited

Wayne Baker · From: Altus Oklahoma

Seems like almost a year now since I asked... Whats the deal with the ninth string. I received several replys and some good lessons as well. Seems like the ninth string has kinda' grown on me and has shaped "my" sound. One might even say, it has become a huge part of "my" sound. I can't seem to live without it. Thanks to all you for the help.

Wayne Baker

John Daugherty · From: Rolla, Missouri, USA

Wayne, I can't live without any of my strings.........JD

Bob Carlucci · From: Candor, New York, USA

Man I've been at this pedal steel thing the better part of 30 years,and I still hardly touch that string!.. I am so used to NOT including it in my string grips,that it feels alien when I even TRY to do something with it... I'm SO ashamed........

Rick Schmidt · From: Prescott AZ, USA

Bob...if that's really the case, maybe you should look into changing your set up. I've seen numerous 10 string tunings here on the forum that lose the D and add other lower notes. Might be worth considering?

As for me, the D is the KEY!

It's a major factor in my chording and speed picking on E9.

Ray Minich · From: Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra

7th string, 9th string, & C pedal, they're just for photographic symmetry. Nobody ever uses them

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

I'm with you, Rick! That 'D' opens so many doors on the E9 tuning, and facilitates countless extended chords and interesting voicings.

They'd have to pry my 9th string out of my cold, dead..... (oops, that's going a little far!)

RR

Archie Nicol R.I.P. · From: Ayrshire, Scotland

`Photographic symmetry`? Ooooh! Get you.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

I went to the U-12 from an extended E9th tuning and stayed with it for almost twenty years and never really did get comfortable with having to raise the 9th string B to D or as I did later, lower the 8th string to D. A couple of years ago, I changed back to an Extended E9th type of universal tuning but tuned the 9th string to C# so with my E's lowered it'd be like having a C6th with a D in the middle of it. I still have to use a knee lever for the D but it's in the right place and unlike the U-12 there's a B string right below it where you'd normally find one. I play with about 3 or 4 differnt bands where I live and I'm usually the only lead instrument. In one group we do "Pretty Woman" and I can do the guitar intro on steel with that D in there on string 9. On a 10 stringer if you lower your 9th string to C# then when you're doing scale things with the E's lowered your bottom 3 strings become the 1st three notes of the scale and then let off of the knee lever and you've got the 4th on string 8 and then the 5th is right there on string 7 etc. So in my estimation the 9th string is very useful. I'd like to raise it to D# at a later date as I've been experimenting with that and it holds a lot of good things too....JH

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Livin' in the Past and Future with a 12 string Mooney Universal tuning.

Dave Grafe · From: Hudson River Valley NY

I played with the 9th string tuned to C# on my S10 E9 for the last thirty years, only recently caved in and started tuning it to the "traditional" D - figured that if "everybody's doin' it" then I must be missin' something. At least now I don't feel so much the freak (as far as tuning the old axe goes, anyway).

The C# on string 9 helps a lot when playing swing stuff. I'm thinking of adding another lever change there to take advantage of it. I tend to play quite a bit of western swing material on my S10 and that dominant 7 (D) can really mess up a good 6th chord if it gets hit in the heat of battle.

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Dave Grafe - email: dg@pdxaudio.com
Production
Pickin', etc.

1978 ShoBud Pro I E9, 1960 Les Paul (SG) Deluxe, 1963 Precision Bass, 1954 Gibson LGO, 1897 Washburn Hawaiian Steel Conversion

Tommy Allison · From: Transfer, Pennsylvania, USA

I gave a U-12 a try out about 6-8 weeks ago. Took me about 30 seconds to realize I couldn't get along without that D string.

Gary Preston · From: Columbus, Ohio, USA

The ''D'' is good for rythum patterns that i rely on very much . Also in playing some
songs . You can get some ''C-6th ''sounds with it also . Many good uses for the ''D''
String . Thanks ,Gary .

Paul King · From: Gainesville, Texas, USA

I use the 9th string quiet a bit. If one string breaks I feel I have lost a lot. There are some very nice voicings that use the 9th string as well as some vamps.

Jerry Warner · From: Charleston, West Virginia, USA

man that 9th string is so much into my playing, how could you do without it but i'm sure some of you guy's can do without that string, so what do you do when you get to that point and don 't have it, so lets some of you pro:s give your point's, come on you great pro's let us know on this point and we will leave you along, bobbe seymour where are you, give us something to help you are the man.----thanks

Tony Palmer · From: St Augustine,FL

Rick, I wouldn't be caught dead without my 9th string either, but I'm not familiar with using it in speed picking.
Care to give an example?

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Ernest Cawby · From: Lake City, Florida, USA, R.I.P.

How about using it as a 13th for fills sounds good to me and I use the 9th string a lot, Wayne better practice a lot before you come back, I am ready for you.
Wayne we had to move our Monday nite s to the Gospel barn to many people for my living room now. Mon nite we had 3 steels, keyboard, two lead guitars, 2 bass players, 4 singers.
WAYNE Carol came down from Valdosta, and Ken Fox from Ray City Ga. Bill Witfield from Gainsville, and Paul from Gainsville, Allen Mc Cormick from Lee Fl. We had a ball.
4 Singers taking turns, and a girl vocalist, a very real bandstand backup practice.

ernie

Dave Grafe · From: Hudson River Valley NY

Thanks, Bobby, I'll check it out...don't know how I ever went so long without that "necessary" note, just plain luck I guess....

Thanks for the bonus CD, too, nice sounds.

best --dg

Dave Grafe · From: Hudson River Valley NY

Rick Schmidt · From: Prescott AZ, USA

Tony...I'm not really doing anything too mysterious with the D string. Lately for some reason the bottom 5 strings of the E9 tuning, without any pedals or knee levers, have become a more natural starting point for me when I'm thinking about playing single note solo's and melodies. I just found that I've been able to learn the tuning much better by looking at it from that side of the tuning. Very similar to the way I look at single note lines on C6....i.e. memorizing all the open intervals on all the adjacent strings.
Being that the D, E, F#, and G# are all whole steps, I've found it's kind've easy to navigate quickly around them. For instance, those tricky but impressive little steel guitar triplets and trills are all over that zone.

Joe Miraglia · From: Jamestown N.Y.

Another use for that dang D-9th string--using strings 6 thru 10 with A & B pedals, this gives you the basic voicing of the first five strings of the Alkire E-harp. The strings are tuned E,C#,B,A,G#. One grip giving you E major and the other grip giving you A major, using strings 1,3,5 and 1,2,4 giving you these chords. On the E9th strings 6 thru 10 are tuned A,F#,E,D,C# (using AandB pedal)giving you a D major-A major trill. This will give you a different approach on the E9th tuning using the D string. The two major string grips are 6,8,10 and 6,7,9. Joe

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

Hans Holzherr · From: Münchenbuchsee, Switzerland

Bobby, do you tune your 9th string D to make a perfect fifth with the 6th string, B pedal down? For chords with the D as root, do you use a compensator on the 7th string? If so, on what pedal/lever is it?

Hans

[This message was edited by Hans Holzherr on 31 December 2004 at 05:09 PM.]

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

I wouldn't say it's a "perfect" 5th, but it's close. the important thing is that the F# is tuned flat of the D and A to make a nice sounding chord.

I tune my F# flat and raise it to match the B on a compensator. The compensator pull is on the lever that lowers my E's to D#.

Most people tune the F# to the B and use a compensator to lower it in the A or B pedal. Either way works, as far as I'm concerned. Heck, with enough cabinet drop, you don't even need the compensator.

[This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 31 December 2004 at 07:26 PM.]

Fred Glave · From: McHenry, Illinois, USA

I was struggling with that D# 9th string for awhile until all you guys gave me the straight story. I have Right knee left lever to lower the 9th 1/2 to D and then 1 whole step to C#. Right knee right raises it 1/2 step to E. It was what was missing from my progress in learning. Without both of those levers, the D# for me would be hardly ever used, but still needed. Sort of.

Al Marcus · From: Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)

Dave-I'm glad that Bobby could give you some tuning advice. That's what this Forum has been all about.

When I was still playing, I also used the D ninth string, as a basis for my D6 ,Dmaj7, etc. as Bobby suggested. It really expands the possibilities of the E9 tuning....al

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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/

[This message was edited by Al Marcus on 01 January 2005 at 07:52 PM.]

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