Pack - A-Seat seat crash

Bob Lawrence · Post by **Bob Lawrence** » 12 Jun 2016 1:32 pm

I was having a good time playing along with a song and doing some recording. I stopped to grab a sip of hot coffee that was behind me and the next thing I knew I was on the floor, the leg from my new seat was completely off the seat bracket and when sliding across the floor. Hot coffee went flying all over the place and of course it found my new portable recording device.

It was quite the shock to the system.

If your a little heavy like me(233 LBS) be careful out there .

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 12 Jun 2016 3:54 pm

Blame it on the "budget" (cheapie) hardware approach. Although I have an inexpensive seat (Elite), it has 3 brackets on each side, and they are made from steel. Those in your picture look to be aluminum.

Steve Green · Post by **Steve Green** » 12 Jun 2016 6:13 pm

I'm a big guy, myself. I use this seat and don't have any worries.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 13 Jun 2016 7:08 am

What about this? Swivel seat fits a five gallon bucket with gear stowage inside..

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 13 Jun 2016 7:13 am

Proof that cheapest isn't always the best.

Next time buy "Steeler's Choice".
They'll never let you down.

Joe Naylor · Post by **Joe Naylor** » 13 Jun 2016 2:02 pm

I have my seat clamps special made they are not conduit clamps.

These are more than twice the thickness of any on the market. Not off the shelf. Made by a custom fabricator.

Joe Naylor
www.steelseat.com

Chris Templeton · Post by **Chris Templeton** » 13 Jun 2016 3:03 pm

The best seat I've seen was one Buddy had that had screw in legs. A minute or two extra for setup but no squeaking.
I can't remember the name.

Bob Lawrence · Post by **Bob Lawrence** » 13 Jun 2016 4:14 pm

@ Donny Hinson

re:re:Blame it on the "budget" (cheapie) hardware approach

Something is not right. When I opened the box the first night I seen 2 screws that were loose(one was practically out) I tried to screw them back in but they would not tighten up.

So much for being Made In America

I would ship it back but it cost me $100 American for shipping to get it to Nova Scotia which sounds crazy in itself but I was told that several shipping methods were tried and that was the best price.

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 13 Jun 2016 8:32 pm

Bob, you can break off some toothpicks in the wallowed out holes with or without some wood glue to make the screw holes "screwable" again.

Patrick Laffrat · Post by **Patrick Laffrat** » 13 Jun 2016 11:21 pm

made in Belgium
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZOpNVh63ko

ajm · Post by **ajm** » 14 Jun 2016 7:25 am

So back to the original problem.

Bob now has a seat that needs to be fixed.

Where can he get some new and hopefully stronger brackets so that this won't happen again?

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 14 Jun 2016 8:01 am

I've had this old seat since '82. The folks at Jackson Guitar Co. in Nashville built it for me. It gets bounced about, takes a beating and it's full of junk. All I ever have to do is check the screw tightness from time to time and I've replaced the nylon inserts also.

These clamps are just common steel conduit clamps. They are about 1/16" or maybe a little thicker. It would take considerable force to bend them. Maybe the current ones are not as heavy or have inferior steel.

I don't know what happened to Bob's seat....strange, but I don't see how the brackets would just fail on their own like that.

How are the legs made? Are they bent tubing like these?

Bob Lawrence · Post by **Bob Lawrence** » 14 Jun 2016 8:41 am

@Jerry Overstreet

re: I don't know what happened to Bob's seat....strange

My opinion is that it's a design flaw. The grade of material used is too soft(I think it's aluminum and not steel) and\or the material is not thick enough.(just compare it with the bracket from a old original Sho-Bud seat) ). This seat has the side compartment and 4 legs but the weight is distributed more on the right hand legs. ( viewed from sitting on it). Then if you move to your right and turn as I did to grab my coffee , most of you weight hits the right hand legs . It just collapsed and of course I wasn't expecting that to happen.

*********** WARNING **** If you have this model seat made with these brackets your's may open as well and most likely when you least expect it.

The solution is quite simple, replace the brackets. Also, I have contacted the vendor and am waiting to see if they can offer a solution. If not, I will most likely look for better quality brackets or have some made by a local machinist friend or just send the seat back to the vendor.

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 14 Jun 2016 9:32 am

Obviously there is a problem. Not trying to down play that, just trying to understand how such a thing could happen. The weight should be carried by the legs pushing up against the block the brackets are bolted to as shown by the rub marks there. The brackets are to allow the legs to rotate and stay on plane.

I guess somehow your twisting motion reaching back allowed something to give way....,that's what I'm trying to understand.

Anyway, good luck with a resolution.

Bob Lawrence · Post by **Bob Lawrence** » 14 Jun 2016 9:54 am

For the thickness argument I've added a few pictures.

(1)Kyser pick (2)Walker seat clamp (3) Sho-bud seat clamp

Comparing the thickness of a Walker seat camp with a Sho-Bud seat clamp(looks like Steel)

Bob Lawrence · Post by **Bob Lawrence** » 14 Jun 2016 9:58 am

@Jerry Overstreet

re:Obviously there is a problem. Not trying to down play

No problem, I didn't feel that you did.

I'm like you, just posting a few facts and trying to understand what happened so it can be improved. Hopefully no one gets hurt in the meantime due to a crash.

re:Anyway, good luck with a resolution.

Thanks!!

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 14 Jun 2016 9:59 am

Big difference. Those heavy ones are like the ones on my seat.

Billy Carr · Post by **Billy Carr** » 14 Jun 2016 2:28 pm

I do something that's really simple to keep screws, etc. in place. Whenever I find one loose or the hole is stripped out in the wood, I'll add a small amount of Gorilla glue to the screw and re-insert or glue in the hole itself. The screws/bolts that secure the legs especially need to be regularly looked at. In closing, as far as seats go, I believe Joe Naylor makes the best steel seat. Regardless of the builder(s), a player will have to check screws, bolts, etc. just like we do with PSG's.

Bill Moore · Post by **Bill Moore** » 14 Jun 2016 2:52 pm

It could be that the wing nut holding the the legs in position was loose, causing the them to be at an angle, rather than vertical. This would put a lot of stress on the clamps, and perhaps caused them to bend. If the legs were locked solidly in the vertical position, there shouldn't be much stress on those clamps.

Joe Naylor · Post by **Joe Naylor** » 14 Jun 2016 9:21 pm

thanks Billy

Since the seat latches are not the kind I use and that was not my seat. I want to point out that sometimes the roughest treatment a seat gets is from my shop to the customers door.

I will admit I have had issues too.

These seats are custom build and yes hand made and it upsets me when a statement is made "so much for made in America" I know most of the builders of seats and steels as well. A few years ago there was an issue with a steel guitar that had arrived at a customer. I wound up helping the guy out - I am not patting myself on the back but these things do happen.

I strive to get customers what they want. When I get a note from a customer that says they like the seat. That is great. Then when something is wrong it is the worst feeling ever. I feel a disappointment in myself.

Yes, I make an effort to make steelseats heavy duty.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Joe

Billy Carr · Post by **Billy Carr** » 14 Jun 2016 9:43 pm

I just call things the way I see them. It is what it is. I'm sitting here in my office looking at the seat I purchased f/ Steelseats.com( J. Naylor ). Somebody show me a better made seat and I'll buy it. When I support something, it's 100%. Thanks.

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 15 Jun 2016 1:26 am

I own three steel seats,Two Steel Seats.Com from Joe Naylor and they are the beez knees never had any problems,I also have an "Elite Seat"that a friend of mine brought back from Nashville about 15years ago...The"Elite"has been repaired so many times that there is more glue than wood holding it together.I believe that Joe Naylor makes the finest seat out there!!

Bill Miller · Post by **Bill Miller** » 15 Jun 2016 4:26 am

Yikes! I've never trusted those things and this validates my concerns. Besides, I've always thought they were the most outlandishly expensive steel guitar accessory of all. I prefer a folding bench. No storage ( substitute a sturdy nylon gym bag with zippered pockets) but they are way stronger and they don't cost as much.

Jess Tolbirt · Post by **Jess Tolbirt** » 15 Jun 2016 5:03 am

the thin clamp is an EMT conduit clamp.
The thicker clamp is a Rigid conduit clamp..
go to your local electrical supply dealer or electrician and ask for a few rigid clamps and they will most likely give you some..

Charlie McDonald · Post by **Charlie McDonald** » 15 Jun 2016 5:14 am

It seems I've seen a pipe hanger like this but I don't remember where or if they're still made.
One could get strap and bend it easily enough I'd think.

The Bremer seat, posted by Patrick, is the nicest piece of engineering and design I've seen.

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