Id like to talk about fiddles?

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 31 Mar 2016 11:50 am

Here's my small collection.

Post by **Brad Bechtel** » 31 Mar 2016 12:36 pm

They'd probably enjoy having you join the discussion at the Fiddle Hangout, then. That's a nice collection!

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 31 Mar 2016 12:53 pm

Thanks Brad! I wasn't aware of the fiddle hangout...and honestly, I haven't won over anyone here, so I'm hesitant.
I know there are some fiddlers here on this forum, thought I might strike up a conversation about something else I know nothing about...

Bill Cunningham · Post by **Bill Cunningham** » 31 Mar 2016 6:11 pm

Nice collection. My dad was a fiddle player and I now have most of his as he passed a few years ago. I'll make a shot of them this weekend. Thanks for the topic.

Here is a link to a tune my dad is on https://soundcloud.com/user267925385/7limehouse-blues

Rick Campbell · Post by **Rick Campbell** » 31 Mar 2016 8:15 pm

http://youtu.be/ybIntoDtb7o

RC

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 1 Apr 2016 4:48 am

Bill, GREAT song! Your dad really knew his way on the fiddle, very nice!
Rick, I am humbled! Is that you, playing? Tell me/us about this clip?

LJ Eiffert · Post by **LJ Eiffert** » 1 Apr 2016 5:16 am

Thanks Edward Rhea for this intro that my late dear friend Joey Floyd who played fiddle would be proud to engage on this topic. Your Fiddle is the instrument married to the Steel Guitar. Wait,ask Dave Gant with Garth Brooks Band? I know some folks on this forum are to Pigeon holed.

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 1 Apr 2016 10:21 am

Yes, it probably sounds like sacrilege, but I've never been enamoured of friction pegs, so I put machine tuners and frets on my viola. Now I never have trouble keeping it in tune.

I also put machine tuners on one of my lutes, by the way.

Rick Campbell · Post by **Rick Campbell** » 1 Apr 2016 10:25 am

Edward Rhea wrote:Bill, GREAT song! Your dad really knew his way on the fiddle, very nice!
Rick, I am humbled! Is that you, playing? Tell me/us about this clip?

Yeah that's me. It was a video for that fiddle that I was selling.

Not enough fiddles in music anymore. A lot of bands like them but won't make an extra cut in the pay to have a fiddler. I'm afraid steel guitar is running a close second. I play more bluegrass fiddle than country anymore. For some reason, the bluegrass gigs pay much better than the country gigs, and all I have to carry is a fiddle, open my case, and walk on stage.

RC

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 1 Apr 2016 10:26 am

I put bass guitar tuners on my 'cello, too.

Why not, they do it on all double basses nowadays.

Richard Tipple · Post by **Richard Tipple** » 1 Apr 2016 6:13 pm

Mr Rhea,,please excuse my ignorance of fiddles as I dont know much about them. A few years ago I purchased a fiddle at a local music store here in town. I wanted to see If I could possibly play some. They said it was a full size but it seems quite little to me ? kinda hard for me to fret the notes. Is there a way I can tell if it is actually a full size ? Some thing I could measure ? It seems a bigger fiddle would work for me. As I said ,please excuse my ignorance of this instrument.\
Thanks

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 1 Apr 2016 11:01 pm

Looks great Alan! A friend of mine had a fiddle with machine tuners, worked great on his too.
Richard, here you go:

Richard Tipple · Post by **Richard Tipple** » 2 Apr 2016 9:09 am

Edward,,thanks so much for the info. I measured mine 14" so I have a full size. Now for another question,,what is the difference between a fiddle & a viola ?
Looks like violas are the same except the violas are a few inches larger,,is it that violas are more for an orchestra setting ?
,sorry for my dumb questions

Thanks,,Richard

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 2 Apr 2016 2:42 pm

Glad to help, Richard! A violin/fiddle is typically tuned from hi to lo, E,A,D,G. A viola is typically tuned A,D,G,C...I think this is correct? I don't own a viola, but they are a great deal warmer sounding, due to the lower tuning. Someone please correct me if I am wrong? No need to apologize...you haven't ask a dumb question yet!

Rick Campbell · Post by **Rick Campbell** » 2 Apr 2016 3:50 pm

I often play a 5 string fiddle that adds the Low C string. This gives you the tuning of both violin and viola.

RC

Dennis Smith · Post by **Dennis Smith** » 2 Apr 2016 5:52 pm

Alan, some questions. Is that a stick on fret board and how would you rate it? Also what type tuners are you using? Anyone how hard is bow technique to learn?
Thanks Dennis

Richard Tipple · Post by **Richard Tipple** » 3 Apr 2016 9:03 am

Edward, thanks so much for your help I really appreciate it.
I love the sound of a fiddle in a country band. Fiddle players are rare around these parts. I did meet some mighty fine fiddle players when I was on the road with David Church but that was way back

Ive been playing steel now for around 35 years and wondered if I could learn just a little enough on fiddle to to add a little to my steel playing on some home recordings.
I have Band In A Box, but their fiddle players dont listen to nothing I tell them LOL
Any way, thanks again, my friend,,,

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 3 Apr 2016 10:18 am

Rick Campbell wrote:I often play a 5 string fiddle that adds the Low C string. This gives you the tuning of both violin and viola.

I do the same with mandolins, which, as you probably know, are tuned the same as violins. The mandolins that I build always have five courses. Here is a five-course electric mandolo that I built a few years back. (The mandolo is the equivalent to the viola.)

Dennis Smith wrote:Alan... Is that a stick on fret board and how would you rate it? Also what type tuners are you using?...

Yes, I used a stick-on fretboard. http://thefiddleshop.net/87000_fiddle_f ... etters.asp
It can be removed if I ever wanted to sell the viola. They work surprisingly well. They make self-adhesive fretboards out of plastic for all sizes of violins, violas and cellos.
I don't remember what brand of tuners I used. I'm continually building instruments so I just pulled them out of my stock. (I buy them by the dozens.) Any brand of tuner would work, as long as you buy the individual ones and not the conjoined ones. By the way, you might be interested to know that the standard spacing for tuners on a guitar and a mandolin are the same. That is, the standard distance from the first to the third string tuner on a guitar is the same as the standard distance from the first to the fourth string tuner on a mandolin. This means that if you want to convert a six-string guitar or lap steel to eight-string, you just have to plug up the holes for the second and fifth strings with dowelling, drill new intermediate holes, and the standard 4-on-a-side mandolin tuners will just drop straight in.
I have to point out, though, that some mandolins and guitars use nonstandard spacing, so check first.
I've converted several 6-string lap steels to 8-string by this method.

Doug Clark · Post by **Doug Clark** » 4 Apr 2016 8:11 pm

Edward Rhea wrote:Here's my small collection.

Nice. Is that a Steinberger in the foreground?

Tom Quinn · Post by **Tom Quinn** » 5 Apr 2016 7:11 pm

Just got a killer fiddle last Thursday. And I have a Maggini bench-made copy by Asa White circa 1875 as well...

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 5 Apr 2016 7:53 pm

No Doug, it's a Yamaha Silent Violin. I bought it about five years ago hoping to use it for live performances, but it just doesn't respond like an acoustic does, dynamically. It is great, however, for practicing, and not disturbing anyone. I often use it w/headphones and take it on the road with me...no one has to hear my crappy notes and clams!

Sweet Tom, how about some pics when you get time? That blonde one on the far left, was built in the 1800's, Germany. It has a very mellow tone and has been repaired(poorly) several times. I don't believe the top is original, but I'm no expert? The only clue of a maker that I see is "Ole Bull" stamped in the wood by the neck joint. There was an appraisal that accompanied the fiddle when I bought it.

Edward Rhea · Post by **Edward Rhea** » 5 Apr 2016 8:09 pm

Alan, thanks for sharing. You've got some unique toys and instruments, indeed! I think the problem with violin pegs really isn't the pegs themselves , most of the time? People get frustrated with them slipping, a lot of it has to do with the way they restring the fiddle, in my experience.

Rick, I'd be interested in hearing more of your playing...any more videos/audio available? Thanks for contributing to this thread.

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 6 Apr 2016 10:40 am

Edward Rhea wrote:...I think the problem with violin pegs really isn't the pegs themselves , most of the time? People get frustrated with them slipping, a lot of it has to do with the way they restring the fiddle, in my experience...

No, the problem with friction pegs is that they were all that the ancients had. I've been studying and building old instruments since the early 60s, and have tried many remedies, but the remedy is in machine tuners. They are much more accurate than friction pegs ever could be.
Even the best violinists accept their limitations by fitting "fine tuners" between the bridge and the tailpiece. These would not be necessary except for the presence of friction pegs.
I encounter the same problem with lutes. The only reason people keep friction pegs on lutes is because of peer pressure and appearance. I have two lutes, one which was built in the traditional style with friction pegs, and one which I built myself with machine tuners. I rarely play the traditional one. As they used to say, if you play the lute for 60 years you spend fifty of them tuning it.
There is no excuse for friction pegs nowadays. If your string is slightly flat, and you have machine tuners, you just turn the key a little and correct for it. If you have friction pegs you have to pull the peg out, adjust the tension by ear, and push it back in, in the hope that it will stay.
If you really think that friction pegs are acceptable, then I recommend that you replace your machine head on your pedal steel with friction pegs. Then you will REALLY see why they should have disappeared two hundred years ago.

Bill Cunningham · Post by **Bill Cunningham** » 6 Apr 2016 11:11 am

Even the best violinists accept their limitations by fitting "fine tuners" between the bridge and the tailpiece.

I thought the "legit" guys only used a precision tuner on the first string, like the fellow in this picture. He's probably just some photo model though.

In fact, I searched pictures of "E string tuner" and came up with this. http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=vio ... &FORM=IGRE

Having made this point though Alan, all my fiddles also have bridge adjusters on all four, but my dad always said real violinists frowned on that.

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 6 Apr 2016 11:25 am

Of course your Dad frowned on that. He was influenced by peer pressure. "Let's all create a purist group where we won't change anything, just because that's the way it's been done for centuries, and it's good enough for us..."
If friction pegs are so good, then why have they almost completely disappeared from all instruments except flamenco guitars and fiddles? Even on fiddles, no-one would advocate their retention on double basses. Why not?
Pianos, harps, some zithers, and psalteries, all put up with "rest pins", which are almost as bad as friction pegs. But harpists would be glad of machine tuners except that they have so many strings that it would be an expensive proposition. The same goes for hammer dulcimers. I play the hammer dulcimer, and I've built them, and I would long for machine tuners to simplify the tuning.

Friction pegs are yesterday's technology ...all that we had at the time. There's no place for them in the modern world.

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Id like to talk about fiddles?

Id like to talk about fiddles?

It's all a Big Fiddle

Re: Id like to talk about fiddles?