Tuning the Steel Revisited

Billy Henderson · From: Portland, AR, USA

Is there a way to tune the steel without having to deal with all the +6 -10 +3 etc? I don't have the patience, it takes a long time for me to get it on the numbers. Then there are the pedals to deal with. Just tuning it is getting more frustrating (I have a PP). Then sometimes it still doesn't sound in tune. I am sure some +'s and -'s are necessary but on every string and pedal? PLEEZE HELP!

David Doggett · Posted 5 Aug 2004 8:52 am

Billy, once you tune the pedals and knees very precisely, you shouldn't have to retune them for awhile, maybe once a month or less. You should tune everything as carefully and precisely as possible once, then not tune anything but the strings on a daily basis. For a p/p be sure to use the proper procedure. Tune the strings first with the pedals down. Then let off the pedals and tune using the end screws or stops under the guitar. After you have done all this very precisely, you should only have to touch up the strings every time you sit down to play.

For a simple tuning chart, try tuning everything to 441, except on E9 tune the G#s (strings 3 and 6) to 439. Do the same on C6, except tune the Es to 439. This is so close to most charts and what most steelers do by ear that you probably wont be able to hear the difference, especially if you are playing with other people. If you are playng by yourself in a quite room, forget it. You'll never get the dang thing perfectly tuned for every chord and inversion.

If this doesn't work, sell the stinkin'steel and get a sax. You tune the whole horn by moving the mouthpiece in or out, and nobody seems to expect you to play it in tune anyway.

Here's an interesting experiment. Tune one string perfectly with a meter (e.g., string 4 on E9). Tune another string in harmony to that one by ear (e.g., string 5 or 6). Now check the second string with the meter. Detune and retune the second string several times, checking with the meter after each. You will find that there is a certain range on the meter within which your ear, your precision with the tuning key, etc. falls. If you are trying to always be tuned more precisely than that range, you are probably spending too much time obsessing about tuning. But you wont be alone. It's part of the curse of this instrument.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 05 August 2004 at 10:09 AM.]

Ricky Littleton · From: Steely-Eyed Missile Man from Cocoa Beach, Florida USA

Let me say this about that:

Peterson VS-II.

Ricky...

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Emmons LeGrande - 8x4
Session 400 Ltd, Peterson VS-II Tuner
Dan-Echo, E-Bow, Ibanez Distortion, Boss Comp./Sustain, Ibanez Auto-Wah, PX4 Pandoras Box

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

quote[tab]"Is there a way to tune the steel without having to deal with all the +6 -10 +3 etc? I don't have the patience,"[/quote]

Billy,

YES there is. If you wish to you use a tuner to tune all your strings, you definitely can, but it will require a tuner that is programmable so the standard straight up 440 reference can be shifted to match the way YOU prefer the strings to be tuned.

The Petersen V-Sam and the Precision Strobe Tuner-3 (and some others) are designed to allow this programming capability. In fact the V-Sam comes with 2 (one for E9th and one for C6) already shifted from standard 440. However you can even alter these settings to taste, if you wish.

The PST-3 has 40 programmable offsets from standard that can be set. Each is a separate "memory", of your choice, and remains until you change it.

In either case, once they are set, from that point on you can tune everything straight up (so to speak) using the tuner. You do not have to count or wonder, "is it -6 or - 3" or whatever.

As David so poignantly said, we are "cursed" with an instrument; that when tuned like most other instruments, sounds horrible to most players.

As a result, MOST steel players feel it sounds better when this string is -6 and that string is +3, yet another is -14.5, etc, etc.

If you need to use the tuner when you tune; and you are among the majority of steel player's; and you do not have a "progammable" tuner; you are going to HAVE to do the -6, and +3 thingys! Sorry 'bout that

May Jesus bless you in your quests,

carl

richard burton · From: Britain

Put a .022 wound sixth string on your steel.
Press pedals ABC using both feet.
Activate all knee levers that raise a string.
Tune all strings to 440 reference.
Release pedal C and the F knee lever.
Tune strings 4 and 8 to E(at the endplate), making sure that pedals A and B are still pressed.
Release all pedals and levers.
You will notice that strings 4 and 8 rise in pitch slightly.
Tune strings 3 5 6 10 at the endplate until they sound in tune to the 4th and 8th strings.
You will now sound in tune with no pedals, and pedals pressed.
R B.

Ben Slaughter · From: Madera, California

Peterson VS-II. The only way to fly, and worth every penny.

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Ben
Zum D10, NV400, TubeFex, POD, G&L Guitars, etc, etc.

Mark Herrick · From: Bakersfield, CA

Hey Billy, I hear your frustration. I also have an Emmons P/P and I know what you mean. What I did was sit down with a very good player and have him show me how to tune the beast. I even took notes! It's still frustrating. I think one of the issues with the P/P is that tuning it is kind of a balancing act; one adjustment seems to affect another more than with the all-pull mechanism. It's hard for the person with limited experience with the mechanism to get it in balance, but once it's there it seems to hold for a while. I wish there was a more specific explanation of tuning the P/P than "get the raises in tune then get the open strings in tune..."

When I get really frustrated with it I switch over to my Mullen for a while!

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Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

Try tuning straight up and see if it sounds good to you. If a string sounds skwonky then tune it till it sounds good.
I had a student come by last night that tuned straight up and when he played it sounded fine. I just push my pedals down and tune my 4th, 8th, 6th and 3rd strings. Then I tune the beats out of everything else. If something doesn't sound right I change it. I'm sorta into using my ears to tune lately. I even did a recording session the other day and just started playing. It sounded good so I never bothered tuning.

Some guys tune straight up and can play in tune and other guys use JI and can play in tune. Other guys can't play in tune no matter what systems or gizmos they use. I would say just tune it any way that makes your ears happy and then get down to business on that bad boy !

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Bob
intonation help

Willis Vanderberg · From: Petoskey Mi

Mark:
One big problem with a p/p guitar is the changer has to be in tune. If not, all the tuning with the keys and end plate screws will not work.A lot of times the guitar is so far out of the normal adjustment range that nothing seems to work.If you have a p/p tech in your area this is the way to go.
If set up properly to start with and you follow recommended tuning procedures they are pretty easy to keep in tune.Do you have the Emmons instruction manual for p/p guitars ? if not they are available on the forum.Also dont be afraid to turn that guitar over and study the mechanics of it.
Bud.

Ray Montee · From: Portland, Oregon (deceased)

Some times cheap strings, a bad string, or a worn out inexpensive guitar can make everything sound out of tune, EVEN A DRUMMER!

Regardless of HOW YOU TUNE YOUR GUITAR, or which expensive or inexpensive TUNER you use, it's most likely that another quality musician will find YOUR GUITAR horribly out of tune, should he/she sit down to play a simple tune on it.

"EARS" have it. If you have a tin ear, per chance, all the equipment in the world will not make your guitar sound in tune.

Fighter pilots with poor vision were seldom on the top end of "combat kills"......since they likely couldn't see the enemy until they themselves had been shot out of the sky.

Take your guitar. De-tune every string on it by a bunch. Then take the high E string up to where you feel it should be. Then tune each string in order, from top to bottom, to where you feel they should be, based on YOUR EAR. If it sounds "In TUNE", it likely is. If not, keep working on it.

You don't solo an airplane until you've proven you can land it alone. Don't go out playing/trying to play music, if you first haven't learned how to tune your rig.

Make sense?

Eric West · From: Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.

Well there's a lot to be said for tuning all your strings and all your changes exactly straight up.

Reading This, with special attention to Mr Emmons' comments might save you a lot more time chasing the tails of the incrongruities.

quote:
My apologies for not explaining up front Bill, but I do tune everything ET. Compensation is what I had to deal with tuning the old way but now it’s a thing of the past. I may go a cent or so flat in some cases but strictly to handle temp changes under certain conditions.
Also when I hear a JI steel third in a ET track, flat is the only word I can come up with. -Mr Emmons-

Playing with other instruments, and especially electronis keyboards will help you develop a method of playing that allows you to actually hear proper semi-tones.

It takes a while, but in the end it'll save you a lot of grief.

You'd be miles better off to realise that "Tuning the Beats Out" and "Being in Tune" are not the same. Not by a durn sight..

Others' results may vary of course.

Read it.

EJL

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