Buzzing Roller Nut

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 11:21 am

I restrung my keyless BMI last night and the 2nd and 4th strings are now buzzing at the roller nut. It appears there is room for the 4th nut to move along the nut axis (perpendicular to the string orientation). How do I fix this?

I searched but couldn't find any relevant topics. I don't think lubricant would help, but perhaps it would? I have a gig in two days, so I may try a temporary shim in the meantime.

Any light shed on this would be appreciated. Thanks!

Ian Worley · Post by **Ian Worley** » 12 May 2015 11:41 am

Rob, unless there is significant wear on the shaft or the bore in the roller, just a bit of heavy grease should do the trick.

Yours looks a little rough and gunky in the picture. It would be good to take it off and clean the shaft and roller bores thoroughly with alcohol or some sort of solvent first (just be sure to lay the rollers out in order!). Add a little dab of lithium grease to the roller bores and wipe off the excess once the axle re-seated, you should be good to go. I have one of those push-pull BMIs like yours, nice little guitar.

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 12:26 pm

Thank you, Ian. Sounds like lubricant (and some cleaning) actually is the answer. I'll give it a try.

Thanks again.

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 12 May 2015 1:41 pm

Usually just a drop or two of light oil on each side of a roller will do the trick.

Henry Matthews · Post by **Henry Matthews** » 12 May 2015 2:30 pm

Don't think it has anything to do with buzzing but if you wrapped your strings clockwise, they would fit better and be more center.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 12 May 2015 2:46 pm

From the picture, it looks like it's never been lubricated.

Everything looks dry as a bone.

A drop of oil on each roller is the "standard" fix for this problem, as shimming can cause drag and tuning problems...unless you really know what you're doing.

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 3:05 pm

Donny - I have essentially no idea what I'm doing, so no shimming! I'll be lubricating the rollers as a temporary fix and then cleaning once I have more time.

Henry - If the locking mechanism is symmetrical, why would clockwise matter?

Thanks for everyone's input...

Ian Worley · Post by **Ian Worley** » 12 May 2015 3:25 pm

You're right Henry, the strings should be wrapped clockwise. It doesn't make any difference as far centering the string as the groove in the block is centered, but it pulls the stings in the correct direction as you tighten the set screw. I usually loop the tail back under the string on my BMI to help keep it in place until it's tuned up and trimmed off, and an extra loop around the set screw on strings 1-4 to keep them from slipping when brought up to pitch. Once settled in after a string change these guitars are remarkably stable.

BTW Rob, removing and cleaning the rollers is only a 10-15 minute job. Just loosen the strings and the shaft pops right out.

David Nugent · Post by **David Nugent** » 12 May 2015 5:22 pm

Rob.. This is my method for maintaining the rollers; I carefully remove the axle and roller nuts as a unit. Holding the axle firmly between my thumb and forefinger, I then turn the axle perpendicular to the floor to allow the rollers to slide to one end, clean the exposed portion of the axle with alcohol, add one or two drops of a light oil then invert the axle and repeat the process. This may avoid mixing up the roller sequence if they are gauged, if they are not, order is not that critical...Note: On the occasions when you change strings and do not follow the lubing process, it is advisable to rotate each roller a quarter turn on the axle before installing the new string. A string riding in the same area for extended periods may result in grooves being worn in the rollers(which may be partly responsible for your present buzzing problem).

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 5:30 pm

Ian/Henry,

Wrapping clockwise so it's the same direction as tightening the set screw makes perfect sense. I'll do that from now on, as well as the extra wrap. I found my BMI stays in tune real well also, even with the "technique" above!

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 5:57 pm

David,

Thanks for sharing your roller maintenance method. I'll probably fully remove the rollers (noting order) to get the axle that much cleaner. I like your idea of rotating the roller if not using lube. I suspect that contributed to my buzz problem since I haven't rotated the rollers (or lubricated) since I started playing 3 years ago.

Bone dry indeed.

Thanks,
Rob

Ernie Renn · Post by **Ernie Renn** » 12 May 2015 9:56 pm

The rollers are graduated. Don't mix them up. Put them back in the same order.

Also before you take it all apart, put a single drop of oil in between the rollers on the axle rod. Avoid getting any oil on the strings. It's good to do this when you're changing strings so you can roll the rollers a few times to make sure they're free moving and not get the oil on the strings.

When you're on the gig: Loosen the buzzing string slightly and rotate the roller a quarter turn and retune it. Sometimes it's laying on a slightly wide/flat point in the roller. Turning it will get it to a likely better spot.

Good luck getting rid of your buzz...

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 12 May 2015 10:32 pm

Thanks Ernie. I got rid of the buzz with a drop of 3-in-1 oil each side of the offending roller nuts. This will suffice until after the gig on Thursday.

Marco Schouten · Post by **Marco Schouten** » 13 May 2015 1:59 am

Not related to your problem, but are the rollers of the 9th and 10th string in the correct order? The 9th string appears to be lower than the 8th and 10th string. It might buzz when playing at lower frets.

Another question, since these are gauged rollers, did you use the same string gauges that these were designed for?

John Roche · Post by **John Roche** » 13 May 2015 2:17 am

Old trick I have used, with the tip of you tone bar press the offending string down about an inch in front of the roller, this will help the string to curve over the roller, you can also do this at the changer end as well..

Rob Stevens · Post by **Rob Stevens** » 13 May 2015 5:38 am

Marco - I assume the rollers are in the correct order since I haven't removed them yet. I'll look at the 9th and 10th string nuts to make sure they weren't inadvertently swapped previously.

Yes, I contacted the previous owner to ensure I was using the correct string gauges.

Tony Kotula · Post by **Tony Kotula** » 13 May 2015 8:28 pm

Like Ernie Renn said. I had the same prob with an old Sho Bud pro 2... oil them rollers as often as you do your bridge. Use Valve oil used by horn players. And rotate that old roller a hair at a time til that buzz stops. This may help. Sounds like a flat spot occured. Maybe someone can refurb some stainless steel rollers... check with all the techs... Billie Knowles.. Billie Cooper... Scotty's...etc. good luck... i also found out a bum string will cause it.. although new... was on older steels...