Vibrato timing

Rick Myrland · From: New Orleans

I've never given much thought to this until recently, but how many of you time your vibrato to start at about the middle of the note duration rather than right at the beginning? As I think about it, wouldn't this match the vocalists use of vibrato? They rarely jump on vibrato at the start of a word in the lyrics, but somewhere around the middle or so, so if you wanted to mimic the artists use of vibrato why wouldn't the steel player do the same?

I thought I noticed this on a post in the web portion earlier tonight on Mike Johnson playing Lost in the Feeling--seems he is holding off until about mid-note in some instances.
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James Jacoby · From: Ohio, USA

Eric Philippsen · From: Central Florida USA

Quick story about vibrato.

Decades ago I attended a week-long intermediate course at Jeff Newman's steel guitar school. At one time or another we all had to get up by ourselves in front of the class and play along with some pre-recorded track.

One student's turn came up and he went to the front of the room and started playing. Halfway through Jeff stopped him and said in a dead-serious voice, "Son, there are session players here in Nashville that would would kill to have the vibrato you have." It was true. Even though he wasn't a pro, everyone was floored by it.

Curt Trisko · From: St. Paul, Minnesota, USA

I saw a quote once that someone posted on here from Lloyd Green or Jeff Newman or one of those guys. The quote said something to the effect that vibrato is the one element that gives soul to the instrument. It's probably the one thing you think about the least when you're playing, so it's really gotta come from feeling. At times for me, I need to be careful to distinguish between the feeling I put into the vibrato and the sound that I want to get out of it. You can't move your body when you're playing steel, so sometimes I use my vibrato as an outlet for wanting to move with the music. Then my vibrato sounds either overly-excited or drunk.

It's also the element that I see the most difference of opinion on for non-steelers. I know someone that likes it when I'm always doing short, rapid vibrato and someone else who thinks even a moderate amount of vibrato is too much. I've found that old-timers love it when you lay it on but for younger folks it sounds cheesy.

My opinion is that the method that the OP described should be the default. Combining vibrato and sustain helps round out the sound. Shaking the bar instead of rolling it adds a little bit of string sound that is a nice compliment. It also softens the transitions between the notes/chords which otherwise sounds stark due to the bright sound of the steel. Coming in with vibrato right away sometimes makes me perceive the steel player as having a lack of confidence in the choice of notes he's playing.

Clete Ritta · From: San Antonio, Texas

chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

if you have to think about vibrato you're doing it wrong. if it's not natural and subconcious it's going to sound bad.

i was surprised watching rusty young in the studio outtakes that were just posted. he really moves his bar. but if you weren't watching it, you might not notice as much.

Stephen Gambrell · From: Over there

I think the goal of ANY instrument (instruments with goals??) is emulation of the human voice. (except banjos, b0b!)

Curt nailed it..."The quote said something to the effect that vibrato is the one element that gives soul to the instrument." I would only add, your vibrato, is your voice.

Do your best not to sound like Dolly Parton, early in her career. Mr. Green

chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

or buffy saint marie.

Curt Trisko · From: St. Paul, Minnesota, USA

I think one of the reasons I got hooked on the steel was because a skilled player could make it emulate the human voice (if we had multiple vocal cords). I don't really think that way anymore. But I'm not a singer so I wouldn't understand the parallels.

At my stage of learning the instrument, vibrato is something that I can do to make it sound less boring and more refined. I don't think my ears and hands are good enough to consistently match the vibrato to the song. Brass and woodwind instruments can be played in a way to give flavor and dynamics to a sustained note. Stringed instruments played with a bow are the same way. Pedal steel isn't. Once you pick the string, it's just volume and vibrato. When I'm playing steel with those other instruments, it's a bitter fact for me. I suppose that's why dyads are so prevalent... because you can manipulate the non-dominant note to give body to the sound.

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

I totally agree with everything here. I come from a trombone background, so I'm getting used to how once the note is picked, you're all alone with the volume pedal.

The jazz thing of sudden big vibrato at the end of the note is one thing I can do! Generally if I play a melody with a backing track I reckon it's pretty stylish, but when I play it back I've overdone the vibrato a fair bit, so I need to rein it in compared with trombone.

Just as if you have to think about it it's wrong, if the listener is consciously aware of it it's wrong too.
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Stephen Gambrell · From: Over there

Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Separate thread - singers not to copy? Smile

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Terry Sneed · From: Arkansas,

Curt Trisko · From: St. Paul, Minnesota, USA

Ron Pruter · From: Arizona, USA

Yeah, I was thinking Gary Stewart's machine gun vibrato. I love his music though.
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Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

I mostly get to the fret first and bring in the vibrato. I may have been dreaming, but I thought I read somewhere that Lloyd Green said that is what he did.
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Jim Palenscar · From: Oceanside, Calif, USA

I had the good fortune of having the opportunity of Buddy Emmons critique my playing a number of years ago and he commented that I might consider saving the vibrato for the end of the note instead of starting it so soon in order to prolong the sustain (among other things).

chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

gee...that must have been fun, jim...having buddy scrutinize your playing! Embarassed

Ray Thomas · From: Goldsboro North Carolina

The main problem I have with vibrato is frequency, I start the vibrato then speed up or slow down, I guess some would say practice, practice, practice and I guess thats right but if anyone has overcome this condition and would share how you fixed it would appreciate any comments. I do a little better rolling the bar rather than sliding it. Dont know if one is better than the other. I know when listening to good players when vibrato is started it remains constant in frequency until stopped are fades away.
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Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

I generally suggest practicing with no vibrato at all to guys just starting out. Get to the point where you can confidently play the note you want to in tune and make sure your hands are relaxed. Your own vibrato and personal musical voice will come natural and easy then.

To me vibrato is a part of phrasing. It needs to be intentional. If it is something your hands do on there own no matter what without a connection to what you are trying to say it can be annoying sounding. Like pumping the volume pedal or always mashing the pedals when you play a chord.
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Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

I can't imagine discussing vibrato as a matter of technique.
It seems to come naturally or not at all.
Brazilian singers typically don't use much.
Great guitarists seem to use it when the note demands,
rather than a matter of form.

As a learner I resonate with Bob's advice most.
As a listener, I'd rather have less than too much.

Tim Whitlock · From: Colorado, USA

There are many various ways to approach vibrato. All of them probably have their merit. For example - as I was first learning to play 'Sleepwalk' I was struck by how Santo uses a very pronounced quick vibrato right at the beginning of the note. Most steel players I have heard seem to ignore this very essential nuance of the song. Just an example of how the right vibrato really can let the player emote.

Sleepwalk (live version): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogxTQXAgY3Q

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

Check out how string quartets use vibrato.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJK4ToNINLo

Sounds like the same vibrato as "sleepwalk" !

Sounds beautiful to me. Certainly works in context but it would sound crazy if I used that big and fast a vibrato on most of the music I play.

BTW: The Beethoven String Quartet Op 131 is my favorite piece of music ever.
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