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Topic: Burgeoning Blunders And Runaway Motivations |
Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 14 Feb 2004 5:31 am |
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This is my 3rd day, and I'm still working on the finishing touches of installing a knee lever, with two changes on my newly built C6th single 10, steel guitar. My interest in developing a few new changes, that will facilitate notable chordal expressions, have come under scrutiny. Last night, I tuned and retuned, each string on the steel to form the triads, and 4 tone chords, just as if, knee levers were applied. I quickly discovered that the C6th tuning is a monster with the single note expressions, whereas the E9th, offers much in accessibility to listenable inversions. I haven't had this much enjoyment, in quite some time. |
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Mark van Allen
From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
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Posted 15 Feb 2004 3:37 pm
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Sometimes, Bill, I think it might be just as much fun just to read your posts!
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Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 6:43 am
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Mark,
Thanks for the abbreviated response. I thought for a while, that this thread would shatter, much like the professed wall egg. It really was meant to be a teasing reminder, to look before you leap. Much like, cutting a board too short, or hurriedly neglecting to double check gathered information. As we respond to written material, the wintry days bring us closer to the warmth of spring. I've found that a number of replies on the S.G.F., go a long way, in producing posititive thoughts.
Bill H.[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 16 February 2004 at 01:43 PM.] |
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Pat Burns
From:
Branchville, N.J. USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 6:57 am
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..if you want numbers, Bill, you have to stick to controversy...nothing kills a topic like consensus...
...not to worry, winter can't last forever, even in the Berkshires... |
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Bobby Lee
From:
Cloverdale, California, USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 9:55 am
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| Quote: |
| I quickly discovered that the C6th tuning is a monster with the single note expressions, whereas the E9th, offers much in accessibility to listenable inversions. |
The biggest difference, I think, is in the way that the tunings treat octaves. On the E9th, the basic changes work in octaves, so that triads can be played in all inversions at the various chord positions.
In contrast, the C6th changes produce notes in the higher octave that complement those in the lower octave. These can be used for extended chords or for more colorful "single note" work (as you have discovered).
Some would describe this as the fundamental difference between "country" and "jazz", but the definitions of those generic terms has changed with time. Today we often hear extended chords in country, and artists like Bill Frisell (with steeler Greg Leitz) have proved that triads are not necessarily out of place in jazz.
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 Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax[This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 16 February 2004 at 09:56 AM.] |
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Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 10:19 am
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Bill, which part represents the "Burgeoning Blunders"?  |
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 11:31 am
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Well stated b0b 
carl |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 2:51 pm
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Jim C.
A "burgeoning blunder" could be characterized as such:
1. Neglecting to examine information sources thoroughly, before instituting a move to proceed in an undaunted manner, to
complete an unfinished project.
2. Finding a means to justify saying "oops" more than a few times, at midpoint of completing, a complicated series of calculations.
3. Creating a minimum of clamor when served uncooked haddock at a popular eatery, and then turning the other cheek, by leaving a large tip, to the tune of $15.00, for a "meal" costing $35.24. (It was "Valentine's Day") After all, the waitress didn't cook the fish, and as it turned out, neither did the"chef".
Jim, the three reflections or samplings, denote a figurative description of "burgeoning blunders". (I think)
Bill H.
[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 16 February 2004 at 10:35 PM.] |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 16 Feb 2004 11:33 pm
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Bobby Lee,
True to my propensity to be in conformity with the popular "consensus", I must agree with Carl D., that your reply is excellent. It is written with very strong points, that would hold up very well, in any discussion, relating to pedal steel guitars.
I've found that by actuating a knee lever, which changes the pitches of just two strings, of the C6th tuning, the player IS much more in control, and can produce the typical E9th extended triads, in a given fret. This may differ, ever so little, from what you have stated.
Bill H.
P.S. With one eye open, at 1:30 A.M., I inadvertently misspelled, consensus with 2 (C's). I noticed my error immediately this morning upon wakening. This is a classic "burgeoning blunder", caused by inattentive scrutiny. B.H. [This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 17 February 2004 at 02:54 AM.] [This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 17 February 2004 at 04:14 AM.] |
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Pat Burns
From:
Branchville, N.J. USA
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Posted 17 Feb 2004 9:10 am
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| .."inattentive scrutiny" is a contradiction at any time of day... |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 17 Feb 2004 10:05 am
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Pat B.,
Normally, I scrutinize, or pore over written material. I had explained that only one eye was open at 1:30 A.M. .. The inability to pry the other eye open warrants the use of the terminology; as written. I realize fully, that should one be wide eyed, and bushy tailed, he would be at the top of his game; in any event. In other words, the intent was to scrutinize, albeit the misspell proves otherwise. Hence, inadvertent, or inattentive scrutiny may fit better than it would appear at first glance.
Contradictions run rampant among English professors, I have noted.
Bill H. [This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 17 February 2004 at 10:08 AM.] |
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Ray Minich
From:
Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra
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Posted 17 Feb 2004 1:43 pm
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Gentlemen; I read with much interest the goings on in this thread, for I too am about to undertake the pleasure/pain of modifying an S-10 Dekley to C-6th tuning. Haven't yet determined the copedent to employ but have studied most of those available on the web and in the literature. My question regards the pedal KL layout. Should one strive to duplicate the classic Pedal/KL layout and positions of a D-10 (in hopes that someday I'll buy a D-10, and won't have learned any bad habits) or just put 'em where they'll fit and hope for the best?
Thanks for your input & regards... |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 17 Feb 2004 3:40 pm
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Ray M.,
Could you go into detail, by explaining how your steel is tuned, the number of pedals, etc.? This is the first inquiry that I've seen on this forum, involving requested information to clarify how the changes can be accomplished. You have made it clear that you've boned up on the necessary changes, as a prerequisite, to avoid venturing into the unknown. I'm not positive, but I'm fairly certain that it would be "A piece of cake" for someone who has, "Been there, and done that." How do you feel about the E9th chromatic tuning?
Bill H.
[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 18 February 2004 at 04:41 AM.] |
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Ray Minich
From:
Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra
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Posted 17 Feb 2004 8:21 pm
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Bill H., thanks for the reply. I should add that I already have an Emmons SD-10 set up 3 & 4 for E9th, and a Dekley S-10 set up 3&3 for E9th that I'm going to add the RKR (KL #4) to. Got this Dekley S-10 (guitar #3) to fool around with and thought, since I can't sneak a D-10 by the wife yet, maybe I'd try configuring guitar #3 to C6th and see what trouble I can get into. It's configured 3 & 3 with LKR, RKL and RKL (E9th - Emmons). I got some spare Dekley parts from Bobby Bowman last fall (cross rods, bell cranks, pedals etc.) and have a machine shop at my disposal. It would be some trouble but not too much to drill out the pedal bar for positions 4,5,6,7, & 8 and then just use one KL for RKR (like the classic C6th copedant). Just move the existing 3 pedals to the new positions, add 2 more, and the RKR, and I would have the same arrangement as the C6th half of a D-10. Or, I could just use the actuators (pedals and KL's) where they are and install pull rods to achieve the C6th changes, but from "non-standard" positions.
My real concern is, how hard is it to switch copedants mentally? If a fella were to play this thing very much (in a "non-standard" setup) and learn it, would he have to unlearn it when he sat down to an honest to goodness real D-10?
Thanks for your advice, I really appreciate your recommendations. |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 18 Feb 2004 5:34 am
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Ray M.,
Thanks for the informative response. It's very interesting to learn that you are willing to zero in, on some of the possible changes, that can be brought about, by striving to examine options. I believe that once acquiring a learned skill, such as riding a "bike", driving a car with a standard transmission, or playing a musical instrument, it becomes part of our everyday activities, never to be forgotten.Think of the man who can put names to faces, after one meeting. Another good example, would be recalling, those who can play any stringed instrument with ease. Therefore, the issues at hand, to consider, are those of maintaining confidence, as well as, always devoting as much time as necessary, into reasoning out, any mechanical procedures, involved in your proposed changeover. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Bill H.
[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 18 February 2004 at 09:50 PM.] |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 18 Feb 2004 10:32 pm
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Ray M.,
I'm truly surprised to see, that the real experts on this forum, have not commented on the C6th changeover. What ever happened to the spirit of adventure? I would suggest that the certainty of damaging an individual's acknowledged expertise, for proffered advice, concerning your proposed C6th project, is nil.
Perhaps, in another time, or another place, your inquiry would be swarming with responses.
Bill H. [This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 19 February 2004 at 06:48 AM.] |
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Bill Hankey
From:
Pittsfield, MA, USA
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Posted 19 Feb 2004 6:51 am
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