motor oil on changer system

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 14 Sep 2014 7:33 pm

I can't believe anyone would recommend putting motor oil in a changer! All this talk was BEFORE Tri-Flow was invented. It is Teflon based and actually REPELS dust. It never solidifies and does not creep. Spray electronics cleaner to first clean, then TriFlow to lubricate. You will NEVER have gunk built up in your guitar. Do you know what 30 weight motor oil turns into when it congeals? Gunk!

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 14 Sep 2014 7:38 pm

So true Kevin! Some just reject new technological and scientific developments. My first job at Performance guitars was to fix an unplayable guitar. The changer no longer worked. It was frozen up with dirt-filled gunk. Oil.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 14 Sep 2014 8:41 pm

Alan Brookes wrote:
Richard Sinkler wrote:...I recently started using an insulin syringe ... and the work out great...
Well be sure you don't mix the syringes up, Richard, and inject yourself with machine oil. It's not a good way to lubricate your joints and it won't keep your glucose level down.

I use sugar free oil.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 14 Sep 2014 8:46 pm

I want to flush out my changer and use all fresh new lube. I know this has been discussed to death, but I am too tired to search. What is best for flushing out the changer while it is still in the guitar? Naptha? When I had to recently quit playing, I was going to take my guitar apart and clean and oil it. I am in the process of starting up a band with a bass player I know, and can't afford to have it in pieces.

Tom Gorr · Post by **Tom Gorr** » 14 Sep 2014 8:50 pm

My 3 in 1 has this pungent smell, and I think I read it was some sort of lemon oil in the formulation..can't stand the smell of it...been thinking about using Hammond tonewheel oil.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 15 Sep 2014 1:58 am

why not just take the changer apart , remove each finger from the axle, clean, inspect for binding, polish ,then re-lube (slightly) and put it all back together ?

Pouring oil , any kind, down into the changer doesn't seem to be a very good idea in my mind...

My experience tells me it's about a 10/12 hr process for each changer, start to finish...which includes inspecting and cleaning bell cranks and cross shafts as well. A long Saturday...

Oh yeah, don't forget the rollers at the nut ...

but heck, thats just me...

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 15 Sep 2014 4:35 am

Tony is dead on. Pouring "quick fix"(fill in the blank for your favorite) does not clean a changer--it just re-arranges the gunk a little. It might make YOU "feel good", like you think you did something, but it's false economy.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 15 Sep 2014 4:41 am

If you don't want to take it apart, I'd just keep giving it the needed drops of oil, until you DO want to take it apart.

Dale Kath · Post by **Dale Kath** » 15 Sep 2014 6:27 am

In defense of Al who suggested pouring 30 weight motor oil on the changer system, his DVD was made in 2010. I am going to give him a call just to see what he still thinks of this procedure. Meanwhile, after all of the posts on the subject, I will stick with light sewing oil.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 15 Sep 2014 10:46 am

Electronics cleaner will take off all old deposits. CRC Electronics Cleaner in a spray can. Takes just a few minutes.

http://www.amazon.com/CRC-05103-Quick-E ... ca+cleaner

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 15 Sep 2014 11:19 am

"Electronics cleaner will take off all old deposits. CRC Electronics Cleaner in a spray can. Takes just a few minutes. "

I tape everything off if I do this.

Henry Matthews · Post by **Henry Matthews** » 15 Sep 2014 1:40 pm

Kevin Hatton wrote:I can't believe anyone would recommend putting motor oil in a changer! All this talk was BEFORE Tri-Flow was invented. It is Teflon based and actually REPELS dust. It never solidifies and does not creep. Spray electronics cleaner to first clean, then TriFlow to lubricate. You will NEVER have gunk built up in your guitar. Do you know what 30 weight motor oil turns into when it congeals? Gunk!

I'm with you Kevin, I'd never put motor oil on my steel, in fact, I use oil very sparingly. Too much is not better. I hate guitars that are oily. I once bought an MCI off the forum here and guitar was in great shape but oil would drip on the floor from everywhere. I wound up taking the guitar totally apart just to clean oil off. Cleaned all the parts with carburetor cleaner, what a mess. Don't over oil your guitar and never never use WD-40.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 15 Sep 2014 1:51 pm

Here is the Tri flow with Teflon. Make sure you get the Tri Flow with Teflon only.

http://www.amazon.com/KRYLON-DIVERSIFIE ... low+teflon

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 15 Sep 2014 1:53 pm

admin · Post by **b0b** » 15 Sep 2014 1:56 pm

There sure are a lot of different opinions on this subject. I think we can all agree on one thing, though: Don't use WD-40!

Keith Currie · Post by **Keith Currie** » 15 Sep 2014 3:04 pm

Some one here that knows so much about it should call Paul and tell him he is using the wrong oil.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 15 Sep 2014 6:33 pm

Kevin Hatton wrote:I can't believe anyone would recommend putting motor oil in a changer! All this talk was BEFORE Tri-Flow was invented. It is Teflon based and actually REPELS dust. It never solidifies and does not creep. Spray electronics cleaner to first clean, then TriFlow to lubricate. You will NEVER have gunk built up in your guitar. Do you know what 30 weight motor oil turns into when it congeals? Gunk!

From what I understand, Tri-Flow was developed for bicycle chains. "Slick 50" used to contain teflon, but they took the teflon out because they had complaints about solids build-up. Teflon dry lubes may be great for avoiding dust build-up, but I'm not sure how important that is to the changer. I feel most changer wear comes from the polish that owners like to slather on at the sign of the first fingerprint on their "precious jewel", or from the dirt they wash into the changer...trying to clean it up without taking it apart.

Fact is, many manufacturers still recommend oil of some type, and I figure they may know more about changers than I do. When most all of the famous manufacturers switch to Tri-Flow (or anything else, for that matter) I'll jump on that bandwagon. Until then, I'll use what's served me well for the past half-century, thank you. The only evidence I've seen for anything else being better is still anecdotal, as far as I'm concerned.

Bent Romnes · Post by **Bent Romnes** » 15 Sep 2014 6:59 pm

I went with Mickey Adams' recommendation: Jet Turbine oil.
I went out to the local airport and bought a quart of it - will last my lifetime and then some. Lube up all my new guitars with it and have had great luck. As an example, I use 2 drops between each changer assembly.
I keep a bottle of Tri-Flo handy, just in case the customer insists I use that.
Its the turbine oil that I used a year ago on the guitar that sits in my shop gathering metal dust and wood dust. To this day there is no stickiness and everything moves freely.

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 15 Sep 2014 7:26 pm

I've repaired a couple dozen Fender (and a few assorted other) steels that have been lubed with oil - which breaks down, attracts dirt and gums up over time, part of the reason you change the oil on a car engine.

IMO oil of any kind is the worst lube possible, with motor oil at the top of the "never. ever" list. At least not unless you plan on tearing your steel down and cleaning it completely every 6-12 months.

Times have changed. I used specialized low-viscosity oils for years, but still had to dismantle/clean things out periodically. Then I shifted to oil/Teflon - better, but still a problem.

Dry Teflon simply eliminated the problems and reapplication every month or two is plenty.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 15 Sep 2014 8:41 pm

Just for the record Donny. I am a manufacturer. Builder to be more precise. Have you ever used Teflon lubricant? Oil breaks down, congeals, and solidifies over time. That's a fact. I don't use a phone with a coiled wire and a rotory dial any more either.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 15 Sep 2014 10:08 pm

Bent Romnes wrote:I went with Mickey Adams' recommendation: Jet Turbine oil.
I went out to the local airport and bought a quart of it - will last my lifetime and then some. Lube up all my new guitars with it and have had great luck. As an example, I use 2 drops between each changer assembly.
I keep a bottle of Tri-Flo handy, just in case the customer insists I use that.
Its the turbine oil that I used a year ago on the guitar that sits in my shop gathering metal dust and wood dust. To this day there is no stickiness and everything moves freely.

Bent, I use Turbine oil that Carter first sold me. I don't know about Canada, but the stuff I linked to is only aroud 5 to 10 dollars and will last far longer than I will. There's a link in one of my earlier posts. But then, if you bought a quart of it, you're set for life.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 16 Sep 2014 1:33 am

which brings me to another question...

How long should we play/own a Pedal Steel that has an abundance of metal parts rubbing together that require lubrication before we tear it down and do a full cleaning from scratch ?

5 years
10 years
20 years
40 years
NEVER ?

OR, should we just add the new modern lubrication on top of the old dirty grungy lubrication and call it a day ? Not knowing the physical/chemical properties of the FIRST and subsequent lubrication's, how do we know the new modern lubricants can even penetrate the previous lubricants ? How does one even know if it's just sitting there floating on top of the old or previous lubricants ? Remember those classes that many of us slept thru ? It was called Chemistry...

Over the last few months I tore down 2 or 3 E9ths..full changer disassembly , cleaning etc..they all played pretty good before the tear down but they all played very noticeably BETTER after . I used an ever so slight drop or two of 3 in 1 oil, you don't need much especially if the finger moves freely...

No , I'm not James Moorehead , I'm more like a James Moorehead wanna be !

Dustin Rhodes · Post by **Dustin Rhodes** » 16 Sep 2014 4:51 am

I don't have a PSG (non pedal player) but I do use Triflow on my bike and it costs as much or more than most PSG's. Its good stuff. There is a 0% chance I would ever use motor oil on something like that.

Jack Hargraves · Post by **Jack Hargraves** » 17 Sep 2014 9:53 am

I use gun oil, very sparingly.

Leo Grassl · Post by **Leo Grassl** » 17 Sep 2014 6:16 pm

TRI FLO all the way, and not to much. Motor oil has to be one of the worst suggestions I have ever heard to use on a changer. Unless you want GUNK to accumulate quickly never ever do this.