Tuning Chart Queries

Glyn Bone · Post by **Glyn Bone** » 12 Jan 2004 8:23 pm

Hi folks, I hope this doesn`t come over as just another `dumb` newbie question.
I have two tuning Charts....1 Emmons and 2 Jeff Newman....I see a lot of differences betweent he two and would like to ask:-
Who among you is using the Emmons Chart and who is using the Newman chart.? and why?
Also..what (if any) alterations do you make to the charts and why?
And for those who may have used both charts.what ( if any) difference do you detect or percieve between them as regards sound...tone...in-tuneness ect...

do some psg`s sound better with one than the other.......hoping someone out there can supply some answers `cos my brain is getting kinda fried here.
At the moment I have an Emmons pp loafer ( 1980s) 3x4 but will be looking at a new one ( brand yet to be determined ) when I get to Canada in two or three months time .

Thank you all in advance

Glyndwr

Ricky Littleton · Post by **Ricky Littleton** » 13 Jan 2004 12:19 am

I use the Newman chart as my "base". The reason is simply because that's how I learned to tune. AS time has passed I find that I do still tune up the same, but now I tweak a little one way or another to "sweeten" the sound a little, but all in all it's still pretty close to Jeff's chart.

Ricky

------------------
Emmons LeGrande - 8x4
Session 400 Ltd
Dan-Echo, E-Bow, Ibanez Distortion, Boss Comp./Sustain, Ibanez Auto-Wah

Larry Phleger · Post by **Larry Phleger** » 13 Jan 2004 8:46 am

There ain't no such thing as a dumb newbie question.

Post by **Joey Ace** » 13 Jan 2004 9:00 am

Short answer:
Different guitars require different charts, due to physical differences.

The ideal solution is to make your own, although that is not an easy task for a beginner.

Roger Crawford · Post by **Roger Crawford** » 13 Jan 2004 9:32 am

I've tried both charts with my Emmons and my Zums, Jeff's sounds much more in tune to my ear.

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 13 Jan 2004 10:11 am

dittos Roger!

If I had to advise, it would be "go with the Newman chart". Since his chart takes into account cabinet drop; which causes most to have to play sharp of the frets to be in tune with the band. IE, his roots are 442.5 rather than the standard 440. This is also the reason some will complain that an open A chord (A and B down) sounds flat.

carl

Chris Erbacher · Post by **Chris Erbacher** » 13 Jan 2004 2:32 pm

i like the newmann for my zb custom, seems to work out.

Larry Hamilton · Post by **Larry Hamilton** » 13 Jan 2004 10:50 pm

I've been using the Emmons chart with my
Le GrandeII. I would like to try the Newman chart but can't find one short of calling Jeff and getting one. But until then the Emmons has been working fine.
Keep pickin', Larry

Roger Crawford · Post by **Roger Crawford** » 14 Jan 2004 4:53 am

Larry...go to Jeff's web site, I think he has it posted there.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 14 Jan 2004 10:00 am

http://jeffran.com/tuning/tuning.htm

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 14 Jan 2004 11:19 am

Thanks b0b for posting that link. It's been a long time since I looked at it and I would have to say how much I like it. Notice the relative shifts comparing roots, thirds, 5ths and 7ths, etc. between the E9th and C6th charts. It is even applicable when comparing the universal chart.

This tells me that Jeff spent considerable time checking and analyzing this for consistency. I cannot believe it is a coincidence that just about everything matches. I applaud Jeff for this.

One interesting note is strings 3, 7 and 10 on C6. Notice that 10 is NOT 442.5 like 3 and 7 are. When I asked years ago, I was told, "this is to compensate for bar pressure which sooo easily raises the bottom strings on C6." And if you check it out, it works! Again I laud Jeff for this.

He carried it through on the universal for the most part. You will find this if you check pedals 5 and 6 on C6 with pedals 5 and 4 on the universal. One of the few disprecancies I see is on string 12 universal versus string 10 on C6. I imagine this might be a typo; but not sure.

In any case it is a great chart for those having trouble tuning all the changes on a PSG.

One note to the beginner. Both the Emmons' and Jeff's chart are based pretty much on the Just Intonation method of tuning. only in a few cases does Jeff shift away from JI. An example is string 9 on E9th. He tunes this 7th note very near ET (respect to the key of E). this will make it sound out of tune to most players' ears, if you pick string 9 and 10 together, but it makes a 7th chord sound sooo rich; with that "tension" Jeff is so fond of calling this chord. Interestingly on his universal chart, pedal 6 places the 7th dead on ET (442.5 ref).

carl

<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by C Dixon on 14 January 2004 at 11:27 AM.]</p></FONT>

Larry Hamilton · Post by **Larry Hamilton** » 14 Jan 2004 5:58 pm

Roger and Bobby,
Thanks for the help. I just printed the charts off and will retune soon. thanks again.
Keep pickin', Larry

Glyn Bone · Post by **Glyn Bone** » 14 Jan 2004 9:52 pm

Hi Family..thanks for all the responses...it would appear that ( on the surface at least ) the the Newman Chart is the chosen way to go as a basis...Larry P. thank you for your comment re- `dumb newbie questions ` appreciated my friend...some of them numbers and stuff really go over my head..( and I`m 6` tall !!!) here is what I have been doing......hopefully some one out there will tell me if I am corrct or not... I tune to Jeffs Chart but tune my E`s to 440.... once I have the open tuned and then the pedals/levers I then play a few chords around the 8th fret..using the main four groups I then listen for any `beats` and tune them out.....from what my ears tell me it sounds ok......I notice that after I have done this that my E`s are usually around the 442 mark....I hope I am correct in doing this.....and Joey Ace....you are quite correct....it is not easy for a beginner with all this tuning differences....at least on Std. guitar one can adjust the bridge...unfortunately our steels do not allow this.....

Thank you all again for the input...this newbie really appreciates it

Glyndwr

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 15 Jan 2004 11:56 am

Alright, you asked. The only tuning chart I´ll be using from now on is MY OWN. During my vacation I finally took the time and sat down and tweaked every single string and pedal change BY EAR until it sounded perfect to me. Using Ricky Davis´ method as a starting point (just do a search to find out more about it, but basically it´s built around tuning the A´s and E´s on the E9th neck to 440 and using those as references) I checked the values for all other strings on my new Boss CA-30 tuner - the best one by far of all I´ve ever used - and wrote them down so I´ll always be able to use them in noisy surroundings when it´s impossible tuning by ear only. They sound just perfect on both of my 24" ShoBuds. I played a rehearsal with my band yesterday and it sounded killer; my intonation problems are practically gone now. Always remember, it´s YOU who plays the thing and the best thing you can do and the one you will gain most benefit from IMO is developing the ear to do it by yourself instead of relying on someone else´s tuning charts that probably were developed on guitars different from yours.

Regards, Joe H.

Dave Birkett · Post by **Dave Birkett** » 15 Jan 2004 12:10 pm

Am I the only guy who gets an E with the pedals down and then just tunes out the beats?