Are these songs "True Country," or not "Country" at all?

Musical topics not directly related to steel guitar

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Brint Hannay
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Post by Brint Hannay »

I think it's silly to say the Beatles' rendition of Act Naturally isn't country because of who they were.
What exactly are the credentials for "being country" so you can legitimately play (or sing) country music?

Sure, Ringo's a shaky singer, but the whole presentation is, as I see it, a sincere emulation of the Buck original recording, which is no less authentic than similar performances by countless performers who've done the same on stages big and small since the song came out.

I wonder how many Forumites are "imposters" who came from city or suburban backgrounds (or the wrong country?), maybe even economically comfortable, so, despite what they may like to think, are doing "not country" music? :roll:
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Post by Donny Hinson »

[quote="Joachim KettnerYou must be joking. George did a great trick with tuning his E string down to D for the intro. That alone makes it worth listening.[/quote]

IMHO, tuning a string down does not make it a country song. :\
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Joachim Kettner
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Post by Joachim Kettner »

You are right, but I think it was a great idea for that time.
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Dave Mudgett
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Post by Dave Mudgett »

Earnest Bovine wrote:
Dave Mudgett wrote: 1. Artistic intent
2. Audience self-identity and perception
3. Artistic ineptitude may be more important. An "artist" (in the broad, commercial sense of the term) is often ridiculed as inauthentic if he is capable of playing more than one specialized kind of music.
Yeah, I think you're correct in some situations - my experience is that absolutists frequently perceive things this way. And yes, I'm using the term "artist" in that very loose, commercial sense.

But not everybody is so rigid. And purism is not how any of these styles of music - country, blues, rock, folk, or whatever - came into being. Styles are, have always been, and I suspect will always be born as a result of mixing of various musical approaches. To me, to innovate, one must command more than one approach. Ultimately, any musician who performs for a living has to find and hold an audience, and being rigid and inept does not help except in very special circumstances. My experience is that most working musicians - the ones I know, anyway - have to know a bunch of different styles to survive on the circuit.

The other thing is that the entire notion of 'authenticity' is arguable. The vast majority of the people who grew up, e.g., chopping cotton or tobacco and grew up in a sharecropper's shack, or spent 20-40 years on the "Cadillac assembly line" or in the pit at US Steel and drinking their lunch at Joe's bar across from the plant, are either very old or dead. If you wanna talk about 'authenticity' of, let's say, a 'true blues' or 'true country' performer singing about the classic stuff in the tunes, then there's hardly anybody active left who is speaking from actual experience. It's getting to the point where there will be very few blue-collar Americans left, since most blue-collar work has been and is continuing to be outsourced to other countries. But how may country cover bands do you hear playing "Workin' Man Blues"? Almost all of them, pretty much anywhere I go.

I think only the purest of the pure are truly worried about this type of 'authenticity'.
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Post by Tommy Shown »

Brint Hannay wrote:I think it's silly to say the Beatles' rendition of Act Naturally isn't country because of who they were.
What exactly are the credentials for "being country" so you can legitimately play (or sing) country music?

Sure, Ringo's a shaky singer, but the whole presentation is, as I see it, a sincere emulation of the Buck original recording, which is no less authentic than similar performances by countless performers who've done the same on stages big and small since the song came out.

I wonder how many Forumites are "imposters" who came from city or suburban backgrounds (or the wrong country?), maybe even economically comfortable, so, despite what they may like to think, are doing "not country" music? :roll:
I respectfully disagree. I was born in Omaha, Ne. lived in a small town of 2000, south of Omaha . My dad listened to country music, I grew up listening to country music. Not this HICK HHOP TRACTOR RAP CRAP that is coming out of NASHVILLE today. I moved with my family around the country. I lived in some big towns and not so big towns. I cling to my small town roots where you wave at people in town, that you don't know. I am into COUNTRY MUSIC. I live for the flag at the courthouse square. I am through preaching.
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Brint Hannay
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Post by Brint Hannay »

Tommy, let me be crystal clear that my comments in no way support the "country" product coming out of Nashville now!
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Craig Stock
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Post by Craig Stock »

I always loved the song by War called 'City, Country, City'. Where they play the song back and forth between Urban R&B, then play it country style, then back and forth again.

How would they classify that one.
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Per Berner
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Post by Per Berner »

Jan Viljoen wrote:Can a song be made country by adding pedal steel?

:?:
Sometimes, yes. Back in the seventies, a Swedish country band called Nashville Train recorded an album of ABBA songs with lots of steel – very convincing stuff.
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Craig Stock
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Post by Craig Stock »

I always loved the song by War called 'City, Country, City'. Where they play the song back and forth between Urban R&B, then play it country style, then back and forth again.

How would they classify that one.
Regards, Craig

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Per Berner
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Post by Per Berner »

Jan Viljoen wrote:Can a song be made country by adding pedal steel?

:?:
Sometimes, yes. Back in the seventies, a Swedish country band called Nashville Train recorded an album of ABBA songs with lots of steel – very convincing stuff.
Larry Miller
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Post by Larry Miller »

Is "And When I Die" by Blood, Sweat and Tears, country? Western? Country and Western?
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b0b
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Post by b0b »

No.
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Barry Blackwood
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Post by Barry Blackwood »

Double no.
Donny Hinson
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Post by Donny Hinson »

Brint Hannay wrote:I think it's silly to say the Beatles' rendition of Act Naturally isn't country because of who they were...Sure, Ringo's a shaky singer, but the whole presentation is, as I see it, a sincere emulation of the Buck original recording, which is no less authentic than similar performances by countless performers who've done the same on stages big and small since the song came out.
Truth is, I think it's more parody than emulation. It's bad, man...I mean really bad. If they wanted to do an homage, or tribute, they'd have picked a band member that could sing better, and someone would've chipped in so George could afford a solid body guitar. They were clearly out of their comfort zone, and I won't be one to blindly jump on the "They're famous, so they can do anything they want and everyone will love it" bandwagon. It was embarrassing that they'd even choose to release something that amateurish.

Look, I liked a lot of Beatles stuff, but that song borders on painful to listen to. :\
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Joachim Kettner
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Post by Joachim Kettner »

I'm really thinking that if it weren't for the Beatles, the Byrds and even for the Rolling Stones with their version of "I'm Moving On", I would have never got interested in Country. I think they prepared many others here, including me for listening to Country Music, without prejudice.
And believe me I had to take some offensive words from others about Country Music, fourty or so years ago. I won't repeat what I heard because it was a load of rubbish.
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Earnest Bovine
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Post by Earnest Bovine »

Donny Hinson wrote:I think it's more parody than emulation. It's bad, man...I mean
Yes, not the Fab Four's finest feat, but it does sound better than the dull and lifeless Buck Owens record. With those ridiculous lyrics, it does seem like a parody of country songwriting.
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b0b
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Parody of Country Songwriting

Post by b0b »

Look out! >:-)
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Joachim Kettner
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Post by Joachim Kettner »

I also think that "(Changed His Name) From Brown To Blue" was meant humerous, although the lyrics are sad. But what do I know.

Georgie Fame with "Move It On Over":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suZmKsHMsWs
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Donny Hinson
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Post by Donny Hinson »

Earnest Bovine wrote:
Donny Hinson wrote:I think it's more parody than emulation. It's bad, man...I mean
Yes, not the Fab Four's finest feat, but it does sound better than the dull and lifeless Buck Owens record. With those ridiculous lyrics, it does seem like a parody of country songwriting.
Nice try...Ernest! ;-)

Anyhow, the Owens' hit wasn't a parody, but more a country novelty record, not unlike Sheb Wooley's "That's My Paw" or Bobby Bare's "All American Boy". The Beatles AN song is garage-band quality (except for the drumming, which isn't half-bad). Funny, but IMHO, at this point in the career of the Beatles, Ringo was arguably the best musician of the bunch. :D
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Doug Beaumier
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Post by Doug Beaumier »

Is FAR AWAY EYES by the Rolling Stones "country" or not? It features a Sho-Bud pedal steel throughout and cliché country lyrics. It was a #1 hit in the USA.

Here's the VIDEO -----> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyK1bZZ7E-s
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Post by b0b »

Donny Hinson wrote:Funny, but IMHO, at this point in the career of the Beatles, Ringo was arguably the best musician of the bunch. :D
Nice try, Donny. ;-)
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Post by Jerry Hedge »

From what I've heard the Beatles were big Buck Owens fans. Since they were all on EMI owned labels they asked for advance copies of albums of two American Capitol Records artist. Buck and the Beach Boys.
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Post by Donny Hinson »

Jerry Hedge wrote:From what I've heard the Beatles were big Buck Owens fans. Since they were all on EMI owned labels they asked for advance copies of albums of two American Capitol Records artist. Buck and the Beach Boys.
Hey, I'm a big Tommy Emmanuel fan! But...I'm not about to pick up a guitar and try to do what he does. :roll:

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Doug Palmer
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Is it Country?

Post by Doug Palmer »

If you have to ask "Is it Country", it probably isn't.
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Wayne Carver
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Post by Wayne Carver »

I love Jimmy Rodgers but he sounds more like blues than country. The Carter Family sound more like folk than country. But they are the beginning.
Also it was once called country and western.
Now I would include Bob Wills although he might sound too swing like.
Most definitely country is Working Man Blues and American Beauty by the Dead.
Brothers & Sisters by the Allman Bros, sure.
Harvest by Neil Young of course.
Patsy Cline & Eddy Arnold, too refined for country. More pop than country. Didn't Eddy want to be a pop crooner anyway? Rose Maddox real country, possibly comical.
Goose Creek Symphony, most definitely country for old hippies. Now we really get into country for hippies.
Doug Sahm-Sir Douglas, Flying Burrito Bros., Gram Parsons, Emmyhare Louis, etc.
Modern day real country, I'd start with the Derailers, they sound a little like the Beatles. Come to think of it so do the Jayhawks.
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