Lap steels - talk me through it

[Andrew Gallus]

So, I went to see a band called Calexico recently, and after hearing the guitar player swapping between guitar and a lap steel with a Dusenberg Multibender, I've developed a a bad case of GAS. It seems like a good way to get a bit of steel action where the gig/stage is too small to warrant lugging the Emmons around.

Anyway, I don't know too much about lap steels, so I've been doing a bit of Googling to get up to speed. I started out looking at the newer Gretsch ones, and one made by an Aussie guy with P90s in it, but can't quite tell whether either the sound would be what I'm looking for, or whether I'd have to stuff around swapping out pickups and replacing cheap hardware.

I've since started looking at old Valcos/Supros from the 40s to the 60s from your neck of the woods (USA). They seem to vary quite a lot a fair bit on price, and I'm not quite sure what distinguishes one Valco at US$500 from the another at US$1000, if anything.

Anyone got any thoughts they'd like to share?

Tone-wise, I want to be able to get a nice Hawaiian vibe. I'd prefer to spend up to about $500 (~$600 if I end up having to get something shipped from the US). Unfortunately, there's not much available in my neck of the woods to have a play of and get a good idea, so I'm probably going to have to get something without the benefit of hearing/playing it first. Any vintage lappies available here seem to command upwards of $800-1000 for a 50s Fender, or over $1200 fro a Vaqlco, so if I go the vintage route, I'll probably try to pick up a good deal out of the States. I'd also like to see if I can put a Multibender in at some stage, which seems like it might be vaguely sacrilegious on a vintage model!

Thanks in advance!

[Bill McCloskey]

Stay away from the new Gretschs. Cheap and they sound like it

[Andrew Gallus]

Thanks Bill. Yeah, they look kinda cool, but I did wonder whether the looks might be decieving. It's one of things, too, where folks still want to get around $500 for them over here. Seems that for about $100 or so more (with shipping) I could have a sweet old Valco, or something.

[Mike Neer]

Look for a Magnatone G65 or G70. They are great sounding steels and feel really good to play. They can be had for 300-400 in the US.

[Dennis Smith]

Andrew, valco made Supro, Oahu, Kay, Airline and National plus others. Same guitars with different names on them. The six string, string thru pickups are strong and sound great. The price depends on the name badge on it. National being the highest price but the same guitar with Supro will be $200. cheaper. Check Guitar Center Vintage they have about a dozen in the 250-400. range some with cases.

[Andrew Gallus]

Guitar Center Vintage

Thanks, Dennis. There's quite a few on there that look very promising indeed.

[Andrew Gallus]

Look for a Magnatone G65 or G70. They are great sounding steels and feel really good to play. They can be had for 300-400 in the US.

http://www.vintageguitars.net/products/ ... &category=

Thanks Mike. Is this sorta like what you're talking about?

[Mike Neer]

Nope. These are the ones (note the pickup and fretboard)--the one on top is the G65, the bottom is a G70.

[Jay Fagerlie]

I have one also- and it's a great sounding steel.
I bought it from a little old lady for $175.00 about two years ago.

The case isn't original, but it has kept it in good condition over the years.
It's a 1955

[Steve Lipsey]

Previous thread on Gretsch and Multibender here:
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... duesenberg

You won't get the cool "old lap steel" vibe out of the Gretsch, but if you are looking more for a "pedal steel in your lap" thing, this might be the way....and probably better to do as a separate project - one classic lap, and a Gretsch (or similar) with bender...the Gretsch is a good pick because it is easy to install the bender onto it, some laps don't have a physical layout that works (bender was designed for Telecaster install), and it is better than the super cheap laps that people sometimes use for the benders..and a lot cheaper than the $1,000 Duesenberg lap steels...

[Stefan Robertson]

Hate to rain on your parade but reality check - great players sound great on any value instrument. Even a £50 cheapie Chinese one can be amazing if you have the skill.

Just saying.

[Jonathan Lam]

Don't over think it. Just get something and start playing. Can easily find steels for under 400 allday long.

[Niels Andrews]

And don't worry Bout extra strings. They don't eat much, and you might be glad to have them later.

[Andrew Gallus]

Lots of good points there, chaps. Much appreciated!

Steve: Thanks for the link to the other thread, and nice work on the roller nut mod. I think you're right; it'll be a case of going for an oldie or getting something serviceable that I can put a bender on. Doing both is a capital idea but alas, I think it'll one or the other, unless I find a large sum of money behind the couch whilst vacuuming.

Stefan: It's ok - I never go on the Internet without a raincoat and yeah, I should be content with whatever's around, but I just like to have nice things!

[Tom Pettingill]

... it'll be a case of going for an oldie or getting something serviceable that I can put a bender on. ...

Benders can be a lot of fun, but they are handful and not everyone's cup of tea. The Dusenberg unit is a nice and compact unit and works well. I've been getting mine from Rockinger out of Germany http://www.rockinger.com/index.php?cat= ... duct=2405C

Setup is pretty easy on them, though setting it to lower can be a little tricky sometimes. The issue can be that if your string gauge is a little to big, it will be under higher tension and the supplied return spring might not be strong enough to return you to pitch. Usually a drop in string gauge will sort it out.

I don't use roller nuts on my builds and have no issues with string binding, but that is because I use a strait pull headstock design and a super slippery Delrin / acetal nut. Something to keep in mind when you are looking for a steel to mod.

[Andrew Gallus]

Thanks Tom.

The very aptly named "Angel" is gorgeous!

[Andrew Gallus]

Update:

So, I've just taken delivery of a rather nice little number from a local maker:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/331074736492 ... 1497.l2649

Sounds pretty sweet so far to my ears. I'll look to put a multibender on it at some stage; although for now I'll make do with bending behind the bar, as the multibenders are pretty pricey.

Sincere thanks, SGF. You were right: don't overthink it - just get something and get pickin'!

Anyway, clips to come....!

[Andrew Gallus]

P.S. I can't promise that I won't end up pulling the trigger on a nice, ol' vintage number at some time in the not-too-distant future, thanks to this thread. I'll have to pull a few more paying gigs or sell some cds, though, so I can put the strongest possible case to Treasury...

[Jay Fagerlie]

...and the treasury dept is ok with you getting a Hooker?

That's a mighty fine chief of finance!!!



seriously- that's a great looking lap steel!

[Andrew Gallus]

[Michael Laslovich]

Will was thinking going your route for a new instrument but I chose one older than myself. But on a side bar I'm really checking out the Peavy powerslide so that's the way us musicians are . You have to always go with what makes you happy. And if its not fun its not done...