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Topic: push pulls and compensators |
Steven Welborn
From:
Ojai,CA USA
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Posted 5 Aug 2003 7:38 am |
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I've got a bug to try a compensator on my '72 P/P (7th string). Just wondering how many P/P players use em and how well they work for you. I'm not sure whether to sharpen the string while lowering my E's like B0b does, or flatten it with B pedal down. I like Bob's way, as I've been tuning my 7th flat all along anyway for it's tempered benefits while compensating with the bar for other positions.
But I dont want to muck up the feel of my KL (LKR) on the P/P. Such as...a little extra pressure at the tail end of the lever throw might prevent me from sometimes flattening the E's enough if you know what I mean.
Where as these things are less of a problem when it comes to stomping a pedal with a foot.
Just thoght I'd pop the ? while waitng for a new bell crank to arrive from B. Seymour.
I added 5 levers to my axe (horn?) a few years ago by way of Cass and have no regrets. Beatiful job. |
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Larry Bell
From:
Englewood, Florida
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Posted 5 Aug 2003 8:20 am
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I've never used one on my push=pulls, but the idea has occurred to me. I would advise using plenty of shock spring on it to avoid it kicking right at the end of the travel and my preference is to put it on the A pedal. If you don't get it right, you can stiffen the pedal or lever or get a noticeable hitch in the action where it kicks in.
Sounds like a good question for Cass or Seymour.
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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 5 Aug 2003 8:27 am
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Sharpening (raising) seems more natural and easy from a stand point of the mechanics.
Besides that and playing style I think one additional factor with the pushpull is SOUND. The question then is, in which position does the guitar sound better... raised finger stopping against body or lovering finger stopping against end plate (screw)?
... J-D. |
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Steven Welborn
From:
Ojai,CA USA
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Posted 5 Aug 2003 9:52 am
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Very helpful guys and thanks. A good case is made to put a compensator on one of the pedals instead of the KL. Reason: I have a 1/2 raise on my 7th string (LKV), so I could'nt stop the compensator raise at the cabinet as raise fingers idealy should for tone considerations. It would have to be tuned with a Machinne screw w/spring adjustment at the bell crank. Much more of a pain to set up and tune as well.
Since I have no lowers on my 7th, I can positively stop and tune a lowering compensator with the machine screw at the end plate. Much easier setup and tuning.
The shock spring is a very good idea.Thanks guys.
[This message was edited by Steven Welborn on 05 August 2003 at 11:40 AM.] |
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 5 Aug 2003 10:49 am
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On my '69 P/P, I had compensators to slightly lower 1 and 7 when the A pedal was pressed. And yes I did use a lot of "easy" spring; so the pull occured over most of the travel. I was unable to "feel" it before; or after the change. Which pleased me to no end.
I don't believe I would have liked it, if the movement ONLY occured at the end of the A pedal travel; for the reasons given.
carl
NOTE to JD: Even though raise fingers (P/P's)only touch the cabinet during the time a given string is raised, some believe (I am one of them), that the "sound" is NOT due to that.
Rather, ALL the lower fingers are pulled hard against the body UNLESS they are lowered: and since it is rare to have more than 3 lowers at a given time, the rest of the lowers transmit the changer's string vibration to the body.
carl |
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 6 Aug 2003 2:15 am
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So Carl (Hi, btw!), what you are saying is, that these guitars sound best in "neutral" and/or lowered position?
... J-D. |
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Larry Bell
From:
Englewood, Florida
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Posted 6 Aug 2003 6:08 am
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That's a frequently misunderstood point, JD. The changer is always pulled up against the body with very strong springs attached to the lower fingers. The only time this contact is broken is when a lower is engaged -- AND (importantly) only one or two strings are usually lowered at a time, so the majority of the contact points are intact even when strings are lowered. You don't notice a difference in tone when you lower your E's on E9, for example. It always sounds the same (GOOD, to my ears).
Hope that helps explain. I know Carl has had one that he didn't like the sound of, but the ones I've owned have been excellent in the tone department.
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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 6 Aug 2003 8:18 am
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To JD,
What Larry said,
carl |
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