Blues on E9

Bob Smith · Post by **Bob Smith** » 15 May 2003 3:54 am

Are there any Blues recordings out there played on the E9 neck? Seems to be an area, thats not played much on steel.Im not speaking of that sacred steel thing, but a tradional blues style on E9. Bob

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 15 May 2003 10:20 am

I've played a lot of blues on E9th. My Quasar Steel Guitar CD includes "St. James Infirmary Blues" and "I Walk Downtown". You can get it from the Forum catalog.

Most people prefer C6th for blues, though.

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 17 May 2003 12:13 am

We never recorded, but last year I played in a blues rock band, and everything I did was on the E9 side of my U-12.

The pedal steel guitar is a GREAT rock and blues instrument.

Gino Iorfida · Post by **Gino Iorfida** » 17 May 2003 12:21 am

b0b, were you using the 'extended' aspects of yoru e9 tunign, or were those parts played in the 'standard E9' realm? Either way, very cool. nice tone. Playing and tone reminds me heavily of Duane Allman's style/tone

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 17 May 2003 9:10 am

The "extended aspects" are simply two lower strings (G# and E). I consider them necessary in small band situations, because I trade parts with the guitarist. I need to get down into the same range for the rhythm parts.

The lead parts, though, are mostly on the upper strings, which means they could be played equally well on 10 string E9th.

One of my favorite positions for blues is at the sharp V fret position (i.e. fret 8 in the key of E). I lower the 2nd and 9th strings to C# and lower my E's to D#. This gives me a full minor pentatonic scale on all of the strings. It's hard to make a mistake with a position like that!

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 17 May 2003 9:33 am

Almost all of the playing on my Blackened Toast CD (which is blues and R&B) was done on the E9th. Most of the Sacred Steel single note playing lays better on the E9th, to my ears. There are some Sacred Steel players who play standard E9th, most notably the late great Glenn Lee.

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 19 May 2003 7:01 am

Dan, I just ordered your CD- sounds right up my alley.

steve takacs · Post by **steve takacs** » 21 May 2003 4:56 pm

b0b, what equipment did you use (in addition to your hands) to get the nifty,bluesy tone? Nice work! steve

Jay Ganz · Post by **Jay Ganz** » 22 May 2003 6:15 am

I'll tell ya...there's so many hot
overdrive pedals on the market now
that it would make your head spin!
<img src=http://home.hvc.rr.com/jsganz/HeadSpin.gif>

The best thing is to play thru a small
tube amp & just CRANK IT!!!

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 22 May 2003 6:52 am

I've got an E9 Slidin' Blues mp3 on my site. Check out the mp3 here:

<CENTER> http://www.dougbsteel.com/MudSlide.mp3 </CENTER>

When playing blues on pedal steel, I try to avoid using the pedals, and I rely more on slides to get a guitarish kind of sound. Lots of overdrive helps too.

------------------
My Site - Instruction | Doug's Free Tab | Steels and Accessories

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 22 May 2003 7:33 am

When playing blues on pedal steel, I try to avoid using the pedals, and I rely more on slides......

There was a time when I'd bring both my U-12 pedal steel guitar and my triple-8 stringmaster to gigs. I have cam levers on two of the necks to allow 2 tunings on each. The clevers cannot be manipulated while playing. It's a set 'em and forget 'em thing. But the setup gives me open chord tunings in the keys of A, C, D, E, and G. I used to play the country stuff on the pedal steel, and the rock and blues stuff on the stringmaster.

But eventually I learned how to integrate the use of pedals into the style. I still use the bar a lot, but I also use the pedals a lot too.

What I rarely do is use the B pedal, except to give me an A 6 tuning. I mostly use the A pedal for raises and lowers between scale degrees 4 and 5, and 7 and 8. (as opposed to degrees 2 and 3, which is what we do when we play country.) I use the C pedal a lot in conjunction with the first string to give me the sound of the major secend disappearing into a unison- a Jimi Hendrix trick that he used on the song "Highway Child."

Learning what the great blues slide guitarists like Fred McDowell did is the first step. Translating that to a non-pedal steel like a stringmaster is the second. Integrating the use of pedals is the 3rd.

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 22 May 2003 7:40 am

P.S. My A pedal, besides raising the other two B strings, also lowers the low B string on my E9/B6 to A. Bobby mentioned that the bass strings on an extended E9 are important for playing rock and blues. I totally agree, and take this a step further with the low A note I have when the pedals are down.

Playing that low can conflict with the bass player. I only play in that range when I'm taking a ride. Other wise I generally avoid those ultra low notes. But when I do get down into that range, (usually only once or twice a night) it's VERY effective.

I highly recommend this change for U-12 players.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 22 May 2003 10:53 am

Steve, I just used my Mesa/Boogie Maverick combo amp on that one. It had an old 12" EVM in it. No effects. The guitar was a Sierra Crown S-12 with a Shields dual-range pickup.

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

steve takacs · Post by **steve takacs** » 25 May 2003 6:45 pm

b0b, so are you telling me that there is actual, living proof that a guitar does not have to be a black, push-pull Emmons to have a decent tone?

steve

Jeff A. Smith · Post by **Jeff A. Smith** » 25 May 2003 7:16 pm

Although I don't have the Quasar CD yet, I do have a couple of things that b0b has done with his band The Open Hearts -- one where he is the only soloist, and one where a lead player is also present. I think his equipment is basically the Sierra and the Mesa-Boogie.

I've complemented b0b on his tone. He has found a set-up that allows him to play types of music besides country with a sound that is uniquely his own. He does fine on country also, but it is a more modest, less striking tone than one associates with Nashville; still of good quality though.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 25 May 2003 8:09 pm

The way I figure it, a steel guitar naturally sounds "country enough" to suit any of the country musicians I play with. So I've concentrated on getting a good enough rock tone to hold my own in rock and blues bands.

Most steel players try to get the perfect country tone, and just stomp on a fuzz box for the occasion rock song. That doesn't cut it for me. I built amps at Mesa for 5 years. Once you've heard the real thing, you don't want to try to rock out with anything less.

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 26 May 2003 3:07 am

I agree with Bobby, you can't beat tubes.
I am getting a TubeFex for the rack for that reason. No it ain't a Boogie,
but it will be a good sound.
Having a volume before the tube stage allows a great change in tone depending on how hard you push it. I was doing this yesterday into the Tubescreamer and it is very effective on blues back up for the guitarist. Can't wait for the real tube unit.

Bobby where do you have your E to D change.

Mike P. It's never advisable to have a conflict with the bassplayer..
less so with the bass guitar in the mix.

[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 26 May 2003 at 04:11 AM.]

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 26 May 2003 7:11 am

I don't have an E to D change. I have a D string.

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 28 May 2003 5:28 am

Bob Smith,

If you haven't heard Dan Tyack's album, Blackened Toast, it's FANTASTIC! The band is world-class - kinda Dr. John meets Little Feet (great singer). And Dan's playing is incredible. Best blues album I've bought in years. Thank you, Mr. Tyack!

Tony

Post by **b0b** » 28 May 2003 8:28 am

b0b.com/products/music.html#dantyack

Bob Smith · Post by **Bob Smith** » 28 May 2003 4:32 pm

Thanks for the Info on the recordings , im gonna snatch a couple of them up and listen.I guess if i think back awhile, didnt the Commander Cody band(70s) have a guy that did blues on a steel? Bob

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 28 May 2003 4:36 pm

Probably Bobby 'Blue' Black

------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 28 May 2003 9:34 pm

Thanks, Tony!

I still like that album (which is unheard of in terms of first solo albums) so I must have done something right. I have grown a lot musically since then, mostly through playing with the Sacred Steel musicians like the Campbell Brothers, but that CD captures my playing at a point in time, and I love the songs and the other musicians.

-thanks again.

------------------
www.tyack.com

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 29 May 2003 10:49 am

I've never thought of Bobby Black as a blues player. You must be thinking of someone else (West Virginia Creeper, maybe?).

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax