half raise on push pull

jim milewski · Post by **jim milewski** » 11 Apr 2003 3:51 am

I just put the change on my push pull of lowering the fifth string with pedal down back a half step with a knee lever, it was tricky but works great, has anyone else done this?

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 11 Apr 2003 4:28 am

I haven't but would like to see pictures and an explanation. Does it also lower a half tone without the pedal?

LARRY COLE · Post by **LARRY COLE** » 11 Apr 2003 4:39 am

Mine and Greg Zimmers Willians' both have it on the left vertical. They are both 12 string universals. I think the Carter web site lists it for there standard 12-U setup too.

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Playing For JESUS,LC. WILLIAMS U12, SHO-BUD PRO1,CARVIN TL60

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 11 Apr 2003 6:27 am

Normally raises overide lowers on a P/P. However there IS a way to achieve a split pretty well, IF one uses a spring on the raise rod at the bellcrank AND disengages the collar on the lower (push) rod at the changer.

In other words, here is what happens. IF you loosen the setscrew in the collar on the lower rod that normally pushes against the lower changer finger, the push rod will go thru the hole in the lower finger and push directly against the raise finger.

However, this will NOT work if their is no spring on the raise finger; UNLESS one allows the push rod to push the pedal back up a ways.

And I agree, it is tricky to setup. This results in a split with the A pedal to get a C note while the A pedal is engaged.

In this scenario, the push rod (lower) will do nothing if the A pedal is NOT engaged, because the end of the rod never moves far enough to push against the raise finger.

But one could still lower the B to Bb with another lever (or pedal). So you would have a "split" capability AND a "lower" capability, albeit NOT with the same pedal/lever combination. Again quite tricky to setup. Because working with double lowers on a P/P can be a real bear!

Better idea yet. Trade it in on an all-pull and you can do what ya want

(Sorry Bobby Boman. I jes' coont hep it

)

Love you man,

carl

jim milewski · Post by **jim milewski** » 11 Apr 2003 6:51 am

Bingo!! Carl, you got it, yes I lower the B with a pedal (far left, I have 4 pedals total), then I lower the pedaled C# with the left vertical, the lower on the knee lever pushes on the raise finger, got to adjust from underneath, and the spring has to be stronger than the string, this actually works great!

richard burton · Post by **richard burton** » 11 Apr 2003 10:46 am

Why not just 1/2 pedal it?

jim milewski · Post by **jim milewski** » 11 Apr 2003 2:00 pm

I do that as well, with "mixed results" , I saw that this was a change for some people, so i thought I would try it out

rhcarden · Post by **rhcarden** » 16 Apr 2003 8:26 pm

Carl has it right, except for one thing. It can be done with one lever. Use the collar on the push rod to get the Bb and the end of the push rod to get the C (split with the A pedal). You can tune the C by moving the collar on the push rod. It may take a few tries to get the C in tune. Once in tune, you can forget it!

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Bob Carden 66 Emmons P/P 8/9
BMI 13 string 7/7