Is tuning...........really important?

[Pete Finney]

Great explanation, George. That gets right to the heart of it I'd say.

It seems to me that blaming an out-of-tune performance on the use of electronic tuners is like blaming a hammer for a wall that isn't framed correctly. It's a useful tool, but it's up to the owner to learn to use it correctly.

Having said that I do believe that any player absolutely needs to be able to tune without one, to a fork or a reference note, and to train one's hearing. But in a noisy club, or on a concert stage where silence is required before showtime, or to check tuning during a performance they can be invaluable of course.

[Shorty Rogers]

Just to build a little on what Pete said, learning to really use an electronic tuner well is very important and will pay big benefits, as long as the tuner is a quality unit with a high degree of accuracy. Using a tuner properly requires a consistent picking attack and awareness that overstriking can cause a string to deflect enough to appear a little sharp initially. But for me, the best benefit of an electronic tuner is that once you understand the dilemma of how to tune your thirds, you can consistently tune your guitar the same way every time, whichever tuning temperment you choose.

This consistency, was for me, the path that led to training my ear. Using an old Conn Strobotuner, I tuned my thirds flat, similar to the Newman offsets, and my ear always was treated to a third that was essentially beatless. Previously, my ear was always treated to even tempered thirds ("straight up") because of my 6-string training. With time, my ear became better and better trained. Eventually, I came to hear the clash between the my flattened third (which sounded great when played against a root bass note or some delicate harmony singing) and other thirds played on even-tempered instruments (guitars and keyes). Now I tend to split the difference between just and even temperments in hopes of not sounding out of tune with myself too much while not clashing too much with others in the band. Without the tuner to confirm what the pitches were, I doubt I would have ever been able to develop my ear as I have. Use your tuner to train your ear.

[Ransom Beers]

Breaki8ng meter & tuning are ther worst things I can think of,I can put up with a singer out of pitch either flat or sharp but if that singer break meter then color me gone before the first ste is over.

[Alan Brookes]

More than being out of tune, one of the things that really bothers me is the audience clapping out of time. They take off-beat, syncopated music, and insist on clapping on the on-beat. It's as though they had no comprehensive whatsoever of the nature of the music they're listening to, which is really an insult to the band. On one occasion the Beach Boys stopped playing and told the audience not to clap as it was throwing off their synchronisation.

[Gary Sill]

This is a how to for the beginner who wants to know how to get his E9th. neck in tune according to the presets in the Peterson tuners.

This will guide the beginner on how to properly get his or her steel in tune with the minimum work and guess work.

The item is on my website and ships free in the US.


www.sillmusicsupply.com

Any questions, please call 217-433-7455
Gary Sill

[Ray Montee]

With so many folks becoming steel guitar mechanics and creative builders........with their space ship and sparkly designs, complete with ash trays..........

Why hasn't ANYONE designed one of the new fangled rigs with a built-in tuner that's small and compact like the one mentioned above and actually incorporate it right into the steel guitar itself????

There are so many ad-ons these days that it takes an extra box to carry around all of this extra junk!

With tuning becoming such a complex or confusing issue, why not just have the tuner right in the guitar itself where it won't be dropped, lost or swiped by some unscrupulous character?

Just a tho't............

[b0b]

[Ray Montee]

Great photo! I guess "MY IDEA" wasn't so revolutionary after all.

Was that standard OEM installation or did YOU ad it yourself? Either way, what a great benefit!

[Don R Brown]

OK, please indulge a newbie question - this is not intended as a hijack but rather an extension or clarification of the topic at hand. How does one develop or learn a recognition of proper tuning? Now maybe too many years of locomotive horns and squealing steel rails messed my ears (not to mention loud rock music in the 1960's). But it's obvious I am somehow not picking up subtle variations.

I have an experienced steeler who occasionally comes to the house to give me pointers. He'll sit down at my steel, run through the strings, and make an adjustment or two which to my ears don't change a thing but which he could detect were necessary. I had not yet thought to ask him about this until this thread got me thinking.

Other than plunking a 6-string occasionally through the years I have no musical background but I DO want to become a steel player some day (if I live another 25 years). It may sound silly but how do I learn to really HEAR the tuning?

[Bob Hoffnar]

I have an experienced steeler who occasionally comes to the house to give me pointers. He'll sit down at my steel, run through the strings, and make an adjustment or two which to my ears don't change a thing but which he could detect were necessary. I had not yet thought to ask him about this until this thread got me thinking.

Other than plunking a 6-string occasionally through the years I have no musical background but I DO want to become a steel player some day (if I live another 25 years). It may sound silly but how do I learn to really HEAR the tuning?

Don,
I worked with playing along with drones and made a practice CD. I could send you a digital copy for a donation to the forum.
http://www.bobhoffnar.net/intonation.html


My feeling is that there is no point in worrying about how to tune a steel if you can't hear pitch well enough to play an in tune scale on one string.
You can practice hearing pitch and improve.

[Shorty Rogers]

Don, Here's a simple suggestion. Assuming you have access to a tuner which is accurate to one-tenth of a cent, such as a Peterson, on the E neck replace your 7th string F# with a string that is the identical brand, alloy, and gauge to your 8th string E. Tune the new string up to F# to take the stretch out of it, then carefully tune both strings to E using the tuner. You want to get the tuner to look the same for both strings. Once they are the same, play each one paired with a properly tuned B string. Listen closely to the two intervals, they should sound the same to your ear. Assuming they sound the same, using the tuner, slowly and carefully re-tune the 7th string to a pitch that is either slightly sharp or slightly flat to the E on the 8th string. Listen to see if you now can hear a difference between how each of the interval pairs sounds. If you can hear a difference, tune the two strings closer together and recheck. If you cannot hear a difference, slowly increase the amount of variance between the two E notes until you can notice a difference. In this way, you can get an idea of how far your ear needs to improve. For the cost of an E string, you can set yourself on the road to "tuning bliss".

Once you have a sense of how well you hear, you can decide if that is "close enough for country" or not.
Training your ear is then a matter of practicing with a well tuned steel. I found that any time I upgraded my equipment, whether it be a new amp, a better steel, a new volume pedal or even just a new EQ setting on the amp, I often would notice a slight
pitchyness that had escaped my ears previously.

There are many exercises which can help you improve. Paul Franklin outlined one in which he uses strings 8 and 7. First play string 8 open, then string 7 open. Next move the bar to the second fret and sound string 8. That note should match string 7 open. You can repeat this pattern all the way up the neck, always moving up a whole step (the difference between the two tones being played). Once you have played up through both octaves, reverse the picking order of the two notes and move back down the neck two frets at a time. This is a great activity to teach your ear about pitch and bar placement, because the note played just before you move the bar should be the same as the note played on the other string as soon as you move the bar. You can then alter the exercise to use two notes which are 3 frets apart, moving the bar three frets each time. Then go for four frets, etc.

For this to really work well, you must have a good tuner, not an inexpensive meter aimed at guitar players. Guitar tuners are often accurate to only +/- 3 cents or so, which means two different Es could be 6 cents apart-very noticeable. Most electric guitarists use a tone that is not as clean as most steel tones and because of this, pitchyness in tuning a guitar often is not as noticeable as on a steel. Have faith in your tuner. Using the Newman offsets will give you a consistent, usable way to tune. Always take time to tune up carefully.

[Alan Brookes]

...How does one develop or learn a recognition of proper tuning? ... I am somehow not picking up subtle variations...

Talking about pitch-acuity, and not how to tune an instrument, not everyone can sense exact tuning. Unfortunately, a large percentage of the population is tone-deaf. If you're one of those who are it's not a skill that can be attained, any more than a blind man can learn how to see.
Hopefully you're not and just need to concentrate.

[Don R Brown]

Bob and Shorty, thanks for the advice. I will start working on that and see what becomes of it. Alan, thanks also - hopefully it is something I am capable of and I just need to educate my ear and brain to pick up on the nuances.

[Bob Hoffnar]

...How does one develop or learn a recognition of proper tuning? ... I am somehow not picking up subtle variations...

Talking about pitch-acuity, and not how to tune an instrument, not everyone can sense exact tuning. Unfortunately, a large percentage of the population is tone-deaf.

Alan, Where did you get your information ? I never met anybody who did not improve pitch perception with practice. It's the same sort of ridiculous excuse made by people that don't practice saying that people that do practice are somehow "gifted".

I've worked with students who couldn't tell if one note was higher than the next that got it together fast with just a little work.