Well, I did it... bought a pedal steel!

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Marlen D-10W serial 157791 (need help dating it).

It's a little bit of a fixer, needs strings, maybe a rod or two, some nylon bushings for the pedal rod bracketry, and a good cleaning. Should be a keeper when I get done.

Gonna have fun making it work and look good, then practice, practice, practice!

I do have a couple of questions, 1) what is the finish, and what is the best way to clean it, and 2) I am assuming this is a "push / pull", since rods push and pull.
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Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
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I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

That's a pull-release, a cousin of the push-pull.
I think it's nitro lacquer, but I'm not positive.
It'll be similar to tune as a push-pull. I think the Winston book has the tuning procedure.
It's definitely a keeper. I wince a bit at that ding on the front edge.
Marlen pull-release has 1 negative: the antiquated changer (but can be worked around), and one positive that trumps the negative: TONE.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Thanks for the info, Lane. I think the place in the front can be worked out with so gentle sanding and some re-application of some clear.

Another plus is both pickups are working great, and the E9 is a George L!
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Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
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I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Which George L? Some sound better than others.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Not sure on the GeoL. Will have to check when I am working on it.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Dennis Wireman · From: North West Indiana 47978

looks like a 1977 read the four numbers serial number backwards stating from far right.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

The best way to clean it? If you're the kind of guy who feels comfortable rebuilding your own carburetor, take it apart and clean everything (that Meguiar's cleaning wax is good), and put it back together, taking lots of pictures, so you'll know how it came apart
If you're NOT that guy, I'd go to a sewing machine shop, get one of their oilers with the long SKINNY tube, fill it with light machine oil (unless it comes filled, in which case it already has that) and put a single drop on each place where metal moves against metal, and leave it be after that. That doesn't look too badly gunked.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

The area between the fret boards and key heads is either really grungy, or some of clear has worn. Since I'm going to put a full set of string on, I gave thought to removing the keyheads and that way I could polish them, and clean the rest under them really well.

Lane, you are right on the pull / release. I wasn't thinking right when I saw some knee levers pushing rods. They were releasing fingers.

Dennis, thanks for the date info. That considered, I think it is in pretty good shape for it's age.

The major repair parts inventory now looks like I need 8 pedal pull rod bushings (one is gone, the rest are rough shape), strings, and maybe a poll rod or two and some tuning nuts (and a nut driver to fit them!)

As for copedent problems (using a generic E9 / C6 sheet) here's what I see wrong:
E9 neck:
RKL pulls 1 & 6, not 1, 2, & 6
RKR releases 2 only, not 2 & 9

C6 neck:
Pedal 4 pulls string 4 only, not 4 & 8
Pedal 5 pulls string 1, 9 & 10 instead of 5, 9, & 10
RKL releases 4 instead of 3

Just going to take some reworking rods, and maybe adding a couple.

If anyone has a setup / copedent / tuning instruction sheet they could share, I'd like to have it.

Also, what were the original pickups on it?

I'm just full of it... questions that is!
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Stephen Gambrell · From: Over there

Lane is right---Those guitars ARE trickey to work on, but they've got a GREAT tone. I had a (homemade) SD-10, for a while. I was leaving my Emmons at home, and I bought the Marlen to gig with. The only guitar I've ever seen Charles Reece have to figure out. Took him 30 minutes or so. But that little guitar paid for itself in a short time. Small, easy to tune--of course, I wish I still had it. The Emmons, too.

Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

Think I'd pull the changers and find a couple of all pull changers that'll fit. Good luck.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

I disagree with Billy: that pull-release changer gives a good deal of the tone.

Regarding changes, if you can find the parts, I'd correct P4, P5 should RELEASE 5, not pull it.
The lack of a lower on 9 on the E9th neck isn't crucial, but if you can find the parts, I'd add it.
The raising of 1&2 is a recent change, I wouldn't expect it on a Marlen, since Len died before it became common. Raising to G is a whole 'nother thing from the E/G# raise, not to mention that raising and lowering a string requires slightly different hardware.
Notice how the E9th string 4 works: that's how you work things to get intermediate raises and lowers.
You'd need a similar arrangement on C6th string 3, so that you can have both lowers and raises on the same string. If C pedal, F Lever and D# lever all work, STUDY THAT STRING'S PULL TRAIN.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Thanks for the tips, Lane. The original chart I had was wrong, I now have a good one. I'm going to just sit and study to workings between church services today, and then make a plan. I'd like to get it doing all the changes, if possible. I won't even attempt a LKV.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Ned McIntosh · From: New South Wales, Australia

Looks like a fairly late-model pull-release to me. The changer-fingers have 6 holes instead of 4, there is a second "window" on the endplates for tuning the raises and lowers, and the bellcranks are the split style so pull-rods can run straight to the changer. Also, the bellcranks on the E-lowers on the E9th neck appear to be Emmons bellcranks, not Marlen ones.

Leave it as an 8X4. Once all the changes are working correctly it will have tone all of its own.
_________________
The steel guitar is a hard mistress. She will obsess you, bemuse and bewitch you. She will dash your hopes on what seems to be whim, only to tease you into renewing the relationship once more so she can do it to you all over again...and yet, if you somehow manage to touch her in that certain magic way, she will yield up a sound which has so much soul, raw emotion and heartfelt depth to it that she will pierce you to the very core of your being.

chris ivey · From: california (deceased)

jeez...here we go again.
why can't people get an old steel, assess it's condition, tune it up and try playing it for awhile before some doomsday dude ruins it for him by telling him to tear it apart, put new modern parts in it, spend money, etc.?

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

To clean the finish, Meguiar's Pro Swirl Remover 2.0. Very gentle stuff. Won't hurt the patina, but will remove atmospherical junk like nic and body oils, etc.. It works great cleaning chrome too. Haven't tried it yet on aluminum. I've used it on nitro lacquer, poly, and even MOTS. Best stuff ever! Here's an old, circa 63/64 Perm body that was filthy when I got it. One hand-rubbed ap of the swirly stuff made it shine.

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

John, thanks for the tip on the Meguiar's for the finish, I'll try that. I think in places the clear may be worn through.

OK, new info, the George L Pickup is a PF-1 on the E9 neck.

P1-3 and P5-8 are all correct! (YEA!)
P4 raises C6 string 4, but not 8. I think I can add it with a rod and a couple of stop collars.

RKL does only the raises on E9 1 & 6, and I may be able to add the string 2. It will require a double 45 degree bend bend in the rod. It also does not do the C6 string 3 lower, but, RKR does. RKL also pulls the C6 string 4, but I may remove it, as it looks added, and doesn't look like it actually would work (rod way too long).

RKR does the E9 2 lower, but not the 9. It will be a little hard, but with a bell crank, rod, and barrel lock, I think it can be done.

Looks like the clear finish is worn off in places. Going to clean it first, then may look at re-coating those spots for now (my neighbor has a guy that works for him painting autos, so may elicit his help.

I have strings ordered. Need to measure the tuning nuts and get new ones along with a wrench. (If anyone knows the size, let me know.) Also need 4 leg tips (Lowes item) and something to replace the pedal rod bushings where the rods attached to the guitar, and knee lever return spring, wich I might find at Lowes also.

Definitely the case is going to get casters and a end handle.... can you say GRUNT!

All in all, looks like in a couple of weeks, it will be a player...
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

If you can't find the leg tips at Lowe's, try Walmart. I got a set of "crutch tips" there. Drop a penny, or maybe it's a dime, into the bottom of the crutch tip. That will stop the leg end from cutting through the rubber.
For the swirl remover, I do about 1/3 of the front apron at a time. Then do one more pass across the full length.

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Your Marlen is newer than mine was, it used a slotted screwdriver.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Another question... I was thinking since all the strings are going to be off, about removing the keyheads for a good cleaning / polishing, and also to access faded areas between the necks and around the keyheads so I could work on them. In looking at the bottom of the guitar, it looks like only two Phillips screws hold the keyhead / nut assembly on. Am I correct?
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

No Marlen expert here, but judging from the length of the keyheads and my past experience on other steel guitars, there are probably 2 more screws closer to the neck.

They might be hidden underneath some hardware.

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

Or perhaps 2 on the far end, and 1 under the middle of the nut. Still from underneath though. That's the way old Shobuds were. 3 in total.

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

After chatting with a couple of other steelers, I am going to fix the missing P4 raise on C6 string 8, get rid of the goofy RKL C6 string 4 pull, and let the rest of it ride. Should get plenty of playing out of it that way. The C6 will give me what has been missing on my C6 6 string lap steel, and I should be playing it in days after I get it restrung.

I may look again at the RKL raise on E9 string 2.

Thinking about doing some spot repairs to the finish, i.e. sand and re-spray the clear with out dismantling the whole guitar. Then, sometime later, do a full blown refinish, and polish all the metal.

Thanks for all the good info I have receive. If anyone has documentation like an original copedent, setup chart, or tuning instructions, I'd still like to have it.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Howard Steinberg · From: St. Petersburg, Florida , USA

Beautiful guitar...you are truly a brave man. Best of luck with getting it going.
_________________
Justice Pro Lite (4-5), Justice D-10 (8-5)x2 , Quilter Steelaire, Hilton Pedal, BJ's bar.

Scott Duckworth · From: Etowah, TN Western Foothills of the Smokies

Thanks Howard. It's really not that bad, the bottom is fairly clean, and all the workings work right, no sticking.
_________________
Amateur Radio Operator NA4IT (Extra)
http://www.qsl.net/na4it

I may, in fact, be nuts. However, I am screwed onto the right bolt... Jesus!

Lane Gray · From: Topeka, KS

Tuning instructions, from 30 year old memory:
E9: Tune 3,4,5,8 and 10 with A and B pedals (yeah, you'll have to retune 4 and 8, but it makes it easier this way, unless you're using a tuning chart. If so, I'll give that order at the bottom. Here I mean tuning by ear) down at the keyhead. Then release the pedals, and tune 3,5,6 and 10 at the nylon nuts (possibly the screws above the window, if no nylons on those pulls).
Now tune 4 against the F#m chord of the B&C pedals at the keyhead, release and retune the E with the nylon nut on the lowering pull.

Hit F lever and A pedal, tune 8 at the keyhead and 4 under the guitar (there should be a threaded bushing in the bellcrank to adjust when the bellcrank hits the collar), release and retune 8 with the nut on the lowering rod.

Tune the D# lever with the screws in the endplate.

Press A and B while engaging LKR, tune 1 and 7 at the keyhead to where that seventh sounds right. Release LKR, and tune 1 and 7 either to sound good against 6B or 5 at the screws in the endplate.

tune 2 to sound a major third against 5. If RKR has a half stop, tune C# to unison with 5A with endplate screw, tune D under the guitar with the half-stop

If you use a programmed tuner, I go from 1-10, on your guitar, here's the order.
1LKR (G) at the keyhead, then open F# at screw
2 open D# at the keyhead, C# at screw, D (if applicable) under guitar
3B A at keyhead, open G# at screws
4C F# at keyhead, open E with nut, LKL F under guitar, LKR D# with the screw
5A C# at the keyhead and open B with the screw
6B A at the keyhead, open G# with screw
7RKL G at keyhead, open with screw
8LKL F at keyhead, open E with nut, LKR E with the screw
9 D at keyhead
10A C# at keyhead, open B with screws

Basically
Strings without raises at keyhead
Full raises: keyhead.
with raises and lowers, tune open with nut on lowering rod, tune lowers with the screw.
intermediate raises ( 4th string F lever), tune at bellcrank
Lowers tune with screws..
Wait, simpler description:
Top note: keyhead
Bottom note: screw
middle note 1: nut
middle note 2 (or more): under guitar.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects

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