Emmons 'Vertical' question...

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 2 Nov 2002 7:33 am

Would it be practical to put the 1st string raise (F#-G#) and the 2nd (D#-E) on my LKV? I have a LeGrande III, by the way.

I'm wondering, in light of another 'thread' I've been reading, if these 'pulls' would be too much for this particular lever.

Thanks, in advance....

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Roger Rettig

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 2 Nov 2002 9:20 am

I don't see any problem with it.
I love those pulls on the Vertical knee lever moreso than any other.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>
"I'm wondering, in light of another 'thread' I've been reading, if these 'pulls' would be too much for this particular lever."
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm not sure what you mean by this; as I haven't read the thread in question.
I had those pulls on my Emmons and have them on my Fulawka.....along with the 7th string going down a whole tone.....so no prob. there.
Ricky

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 2 Nov 2002 10:29 am

Thanks, Ricky

The 'other thread' is actually current, and concerns a problem with a 'Franklin' that won't quite pull far enough; seemingly unrelated, I know, but it triggered something in my memory, and I thought I'd heard of there being some restriction on how much I could put on the Emmons 'vertical'.

Currently, this lever is lowering my 6th string, but I find I don't use that change; I like the idea of 'pedals down AND raising 1 and 2' for a neat 'major seventh' - how do you make use of lowering your seventh on the same lever?

Right now, I also have the 1st raising on pedal four (along with the C6 pulls), but that of course won't allow me to use it in tandem with 'A+B' (actually, my 'B+C' with my 'Day' set-up).

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Roger Rettig [This message was edited by Roger Rettig on 02 November 2002 at 10:32 AM.]

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 2 Nov 2002 11:09 am

Cool Roger......yes I did read that other thread....and I think the guys have about got it figured out for him....but I've never had any luck on my other guitars with the longish throws on that RKR lever....seems that short rod is always a bugger.
Anywho......I do alot of cool things with the 7th string lower......it's not particularly a Chord theory change.....which none of my changes are thought out as far as "what chord does this give me" theory.
My mentor Gary Carpenter has had this change on his guitars for a long long time....and when I heard what he can do with it...I had to have it.....and have had it for 6 years on my guitars.....
I do a ton-o-stuff with it....but too much to tab right now....as I'm off to a gig.
I have several CD's I'm on featuring this change....and maybe I should go get myself on Mp3.com might be an idea for when folks want to hear "what the he!! is he doing there?".
Ricky

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 2 Nov 2002 1:50 pm

That's interesting, Ricky - I'm going to give that extra 'pull' some thought and see what its applications might be. As you say, it's not going to be a 'chord pedal', but then neither is the 1st and 2nd string raise, either - these are 'lick pedals' in my view and, while I always used to swear I'd manage without them, I'm admittedly curious about them lately!

The truth is that I have two 'extra' knees on my LeGrande (fitted when I bought it new, and I had more money than sense

); the vertical as we're discussing, and an 'inside' LKL. This LKL has the 1st and 2nd raise, but I CAN'T REACH IT! Not with any degree of comfort, anyway. If I put the change on LKV, I'll be able to use it. I guess I'll just pull that LKL2 off and save some weight!

Despite all this, I still consider my basic four 'knees' to be the essential ones - 'E's down, 'E's up, 'B's down (half-step), and 2nd/9th 'lower' - these are, in my view, the 'chord pedals' for E9....

Roger

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 2 Nov 2002 4:08 pm

Can I have the extra knee lever?

Roger I think one day you're really going to want the 6th string lower.Preferably where you can mix it up with the A,B&C pedals.-----------bb[This message was edited by Bobby Boggs on 02 November 2002 at 04:13 PM.]

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 2 Nov 2002 4:56 pm

Bobby

I've persevered (on and off) with that 6th string lower for almost thirty years - it's never really 'spoken' to me!

Part of the problem has been since I had this particular Emmons - it's way too sensitive, and this 'change' won't split-tune to my satisfaction; I'll get it close, then, a day or so later, it's 'moved'! I wonder if it'd be any more stable if I put that 'change' on the soon-to-be-redundant LKL2? All my other 'splits' are fine - I don't get it!

....and no, you CAN'T have the knee lever

!

Roger[This message was edited by Roger Rettig on 02 November 2002 at 04:57 PM.]

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 2 Nov 2002 10:30 pm

"I don't Get It"

Roger I'm sorry to say but it is that plain 6th string doing that to ya.
Don't know if your Emmons will lower a wound .022 a whole tone for the G# to F#....but if it did...you would not have the split problem or tuning problem on that string.
That is my advice on ("you seem to have great ears") hearing that string do that as your not satisfied with it.
Ricky

Martin Weenick · Post by **Martin Weenick** » 2 Nov 2002 11:53 pm

Roger, you might consider replacelng the LKL2 with a LKForward, I think it would be much easier to reach. Martin.

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Martin W. Emmons LG III 3/5 Peavy 1000

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 3 Nov 2002 5:31 am

Thanks, you guys...

Martin - I tried the LKF, but couldn't get on with it; 'though I'm 5'11', my legs are a little abbreviated(!), and that's why I'm so picky about the position of my left 'knees'.

Ricky - Thanks for the tip! I've often pondered the wound 6th question, but was put off trying it, as I'd heard of the long pull required to get the 'drop'. As I'm making these other changes, maybe it's time to try it out! As I'm not thoroughly convinced it's a vital 'pull', I may try the 6th string lower on LKL2 (the 'knee' I find hardest to use) WITH the wound string, and put the 1st/2nd raise on LKV - maybe I'll try your 7th lower at the same time....

I appreciate the replies!

Roger

PS: I'm also going back to raising the 'A's on C6th with my fourth pedal - after my afternoon with Denny Mathis a couple of weeks ago, I'm inspired to try it again. He uses it to great effect on his fluid blues lines. I've had the pedal raising 6 to F, and 10 to D - nice, but far from vital.

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Roger Rettig

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 3 Nov 2002 8:35 am

Roger wrote. (and put the 1st/2nd raise on LKV - maybe I'll try your 7th lower at the same time....) That's going to be really stiff.But may work for you.I just would not want a stiff vertical.Regards-------------bb

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 3 Nov 2002 9:28 am

I think that the vertical lever works best with a pedals down position, because then you have some leverage (no pun intended) pushing up from your toes. Be sure to consider the interaction with pedals when contemplating changes for the vertical lever. Do you usually use those changes with pedals down? If not, they might be awkward on the vertical lever.

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