How many 65-66 PP exist?

Steve Stallings · Post by **Steve Stallings** » 19 Jul 2002 7:24 am

Does anyone have the production numbers for these? How many were black D10?

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Steve Stallings
Bremond, Texas

Kenny Forbess · Post by **Kenny Forbess** » 19 Jul 2002 8:01 am

Steve,
I have the Black 66 # D-1026.
Are you starting a count by ser.#s for 65s & 66 D-10s ?
Or are you asking if anyone has the WHOLE lot of those production #s ?
That would be interesting .
Kenny[This message was edited by KENNY FORBESS on 19 July 2002 at 09:04 AM.]

Steve Stallings · Post by **Steve Stallings** » 19 Jul 2002 8:11 am

Both would be kinda neat

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Steve Stallings
Bremond, Texas

Paul Warnik · Post by **Paul Warnik** » 19 Jul 2002 9:05 am

In regard to the earlier Emmons guitars-both Herb Steiner and Mike Cass have info about serial numbers of guitars known to exist and thoughts about possible production totals-while I was trying to convince Herb to publish something about it-Cass probably keeps his info in a little black book-or only in his brain's memory bank

Jim Eaton · Post by **Jim Eaton** » 19 Jul 2002 9:18 am

"How many 65-66 PP exist?"
NOT ENOUGH!!!!!
JE:-)>

Jeff Evans · Post by **Jeff Evans** » 19 Jul 2002 9:40 am

I've wondered why 1964-1966 models are the holy grail(s) of pedal steel in the Emmons universe. Does a '66 sound discernibly better than say, a 1978? Does their value derive from scarcity? '60s chic? Their presence during the Golden Honky-Tonk era?

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 19 Jul 2002 1:46 pm

´60s chic? Their presence during the Golden Honky-Tonk era?

There must be something more to it. ShoBuds and other brands from that same era have pretty much sunk into obscurity.

Paul Warnik · Post by **Paul Warnik** » 19 Jul 2002 1:57 pm

Jeff E-I had played and owned a fair number of later "cut-tail changer" Emmons P/P guitars and a few Legrandes-none of them had the tone of my '66 bolt-on perhaps the early 67 cut-tail came close-it has been discussed here before about the pros/cons of the bolt-on changer and it is acknowledged that some of them may not stay in tune as others-but dont confuse this issue-my 66 bolt-on stays in tune with regard to the strings and the changer staying at or returning to pitch but the guitar does detune some because of cabinet drop-Cass has stated that the later "flat back" or "fat back" guitars detune less-he also told me for a long time how the 65 wraparound model was "The Cats Pajamas" and after I got my first 65 from him I found out what the fuss was about all this time-I have owned a few magical instruments and the 65 truly is one of them-my partner in the production of the Bigsby re-issue guitars builds his own manufacture model of pedal steel-to his own specifications due to his lack of satisfaction with what is available-yet when he played my 65 wraparound he admitted that it was the best pedal steel that he ever played-nuff said

Nick Reed · Post by **Nick Reed** » 19 Jul 2002 9:13 pm

I have 2 66's black P/P's, My D-10 is serial #2615, and my S-10 is #1068-S. To Kenny Forbess, are you sure yours is a 66'?
The D-10's that year did not have a (D) on the serial #'s. I talked with Ron Lashley Sr. about this very thing years ago before he passed away. Does your guitar have the bolt-on changers? If so, than it probably is a 66'. Nick

See my 66 Emmons P/P Guitars:
http://personal.bellsouth.net/bna/a/m/am1070/page10.html [This message was edited by Nick Reed on 19 July 2002 at 10:24 PM.]

Kenny Forbess · Post by **Kenny Forbess** » 20 Jul 2002 4:50 am

Sorry Nick,I got the "D" before the #. it's 1026 D.
it also has 8-3-65 stamped on the same end-plate on the C6th neck.
It is a bolt-on, plays really well and Stays in tune.
This guitar came with only 1 lever (tear-drop Sho~Bud style)RKL.
It is Blue flock under the body.
matches the interior of the case.

One thing I'd like to find out, My fret boards are different than any I've ever seen.
They are the chrome frets, but the normal "BLUE" atoms on all I've ever seen,,on my guitar they are "Beige".,,, they came on the guitar.

Have any of you guy's seen any fretboards like these?
Wish I could find another set like'm.
thanks,
Kenny

edited for info of fretboards

[This message was edited by KENNY FORBESS on 20 July 2002 at 05:55 AM.]

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 20 Jul 2002 6:03 am

Very interesting Kenny.I've never seen the fret boards you mention or an Emmons tear-drop knee.But then again I've only seen a hand-full of untouched 64's and 65's.

Some of you may or may not know that Emmons built some if not all bolt on's untill mid 67.I know because dad received his 67 bolt at the factory in July 67.We are sure about the date.Also I thought all 65's where wrap arounds.Kenny's guitar proves this to be false.Learn something every day.Well almost.

To Mike Cass,Herb or Bobbe.Where tear-drop knees fairly common on early Emmons? Thanks -bb

Kenny Forbess · Post by **Kenny Forbess** » 20 Jul 2002 9:05 am

Bobby, mine is a 66 bolt-on,i know that for a fact.

It's not a wrap-around. it just has that 8-3-65,(I took it to be a DATE)on the changer end-plate,, on the C6th side of it.

I've seen some 66's and a 67 with the Sho~Bud tear-drop lever, usually just 1 on the guitar tho.

KF

Gary Morrison · Post by **Gary Morrison** » 20 Jul 2002 6:06 pm

Here's a 1966 Emmons Buddy calls "Blondie". It's 'still' 100% original since the day it came from Buddy to Ron Sr. to me. More interesting is that Ron didn't serialize this guitar.

And yes, the guitar came with Buddy's finger picks, which are still on the guitar. I guess those make the tone even more special!

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 20 Jul 2002 10:42 pm

A 66 wrap-around?Small decal Interesting indeed.Are you sure it's not a 65?Dad's 67 has no serial # either.Great looking axe Gary.[This message was edited by Bobby Boggs on 21 July 2002 at 06:39 AM.]

Gary Morrison · Post by **Gary Morrison** » 21 Jul 2002 7:55 am

Bobby, it may be a 1965. I used 1966 because there is an ad for 1966 Emmons guitars, with Buddy seated behind this guitar. Ron Lashley built this guitar, and Buddy used it for 4 to 6 months. When Buddy brought this guitar back for his next Emmons, Ron called my dad to get this guitar. My dad and Ron were good friends and Ron wanted me to have this guitar. I don't remember the exact month I got it, somewhere in late spring or early summer of 1966. So I guess depending upon how long Buddy had it, it probably is a 1965. When I posted a picture of this guitar in the past, Herb Steiner sent me a picture showing this guitar as an advertisement for 1966 Emmons guitars!

Jeff Evans · Post by **Jeff Evans** » 21 Jul 2002 2:59 pm

I've been using these "Blondie" photos off and on for monitor wallpaper ever since the shots debuted. What a lovely instrument!

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Jeff

"If you can hear it, you can have it."
--Ray Brown

Frank Parish · Post by **Frank Parish** » 21 Jul 2002 4:54 pm

Gary,
That's one to die for, wish I had it! I've got a bolt-on #1067, black that stays in tune perfectly and has virtually no cabinet drop.

Kenny,
Could those other numbers on your guitar be the invoice numbers? I heard some had those instead of or along with the serial numbers.

Kenny Forbess · Post by **Kenny Forbess** » 21 Jul 2002 5:47 pm

Frank, I really don't know, but I don't think so, because they're actually like this:
8/3/65 instead of dashes between the #s as I put in the previous post.

Nick Reed · Post by **Nick Reed** » 21 Jul 2002 6:20 pm

Gary:
Frank don't need that guitar, please just sell it to me.

Nick

My 66' Emmons Page:
http://personal.bellsouth.net/bna/a/m/am1070/page10.html

Gary Morrison · Post by **Gary Morrison** » 23 Jul 2002 4:03 pm

Thanks for all the kind words from everybody!

I suspect that we're all about the same when it comes to our guitars. My dad bought this guitar for me when I was 14 years old. After having it for 37 years, I could not possibly part with it. I've only been married for 21 years, so guess who goes first!

(Not really). But if the time were to ever come in the future that I felt it was time to part with it, I know I can talk to all of you, thanks to the Steel Guitar Forum. As we all know, one can never have enough steel guitars! I'm at around 20 right now, and I know for a fact that I need at least 5 more!

Larry Moore · Post by **Larry Moore** » 31 Jul 2002 7:40 am

I have a Rose Wood D-10 S/N 1153-D Think it is a 1967 It is a Split tail. Plays & Sounds Great. Just like it is suppose too. It is Emmons Set up 8-5
Larry