Carter Starter vs Sho Bud maverick

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 17 May 2002 8:12 am

Yesterday I gave a lesson to a newbie with a Maverick. It has been years since I touched one, and I forgot just how awful they are. I think they should all be rounded up and burned.

It made me appreciate the Carter Starter that much more. Aside from the fact that it has 4 knee levers, the overall quality is so much better....

John and Ann have done a real service to the entire steel guitar community by making the first decent student guitars. I hope they sell a million of them.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 17 May 2002 8:48 am

The Sho-Bud Maverick was a very limited instrument. The Carter Starter, on the other hand, has everything you need to work you way through all of the instructional material that is available for the E9th tuning.

If you try to learn to play on a Maverick, you'll quickly run into changes in the tab that you don't have on your instrument. I can only imagine the frustrations of beginning players who start with only 1 knee lever, and discover that even the basic beginner courses require 2 or 3.

I enjoy playing my Maverick (2 pedals, 1 lever) in the same way that I enjoy playing lap steel. The limitations are challenging, and I enjoy a good musical challenge. Beginners have enough of a challenge just learning to play. They don't need the additional burdon of working around things in the tab that aren't available on their instrument.

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic) Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6)

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 17 May 2002 8:54 am

Do keep in mind though that the Maverick brought many of us into the pedal steel world back in the 70's. It had it's place and it's a good thing it was there or maybe many of us would not be...But certainly by today's standards the Maverick as well as the Emmons and MSA student guitars from that time period are limited as compared to the 4 knee lever Carter Starter.
tp

Roy Thomson · Post by **Roy Thomson** » 17 May 2002 9:37 am

The Maverick is the worst steel guitar I ever
played in my life...bar none.
Our local Steel Guitar Club has one here for
new prospective students to try for a month.
I think that is a mistake. It's terrible!
It tends to discourage more than encourage.
It would be a bad day indeed if I saw one of those things coming through my door.
No way!

Tommy Minniear · Post by **Tommy Minniear** » 17 May 2002 10:16 am

I agree with Tony. A Maverick was the first pedal steel that I, and obviously several hundred other people, owned. I recall advancing to pedal steels with more knees, pedals, and necks. It was a matter, as it is today, of wanting to do something and knowing there are financial limits as to what you can afford. Sure, a lot of these Mavericks on eBay go for the same price or more than a Carter Starter cost. Two reasons: the people buying them aren't aware that a better steel can be bought for a comparable amount of money, and they are being bought because they do have a place in Pedal Steel Guitar History. Remember "all" you didn't know when you started? I still have a soft spot in my heart for my "first".

------------------
Tommy Minniear
www.ntsga.com

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 17 May 2002 10:24 am

Mavericks are real hunks of junk in my experience. The crapmetal they used is brittle and weak. I had students unfortunate enough to own one of these that broke changer fingers because they pushed down a pedal. The levers snap off also with very little effort.

On the other hand the Carter Starter works very well and sounds surprisingly good. Out of about 25 of them that I have checked out with new players only one had a small problem and the guys at Carter fixed it right away and at there expense.

If you have a Maverick I suggest dumping it on some collector fool on Ebay while you still can.

Bob

BTW:
Tommy M,
I also have a soft spot in my heart for one of my firsts. But if I knew then what I know now I would have run screaming the first time she smiled at me

[This message was edited by Bob Hoffnar on 17 May 2002 at 11:29 AM.]

Roy Thomson · Post by **Roy Thomson** » 17 May 2002 10:25 am

I started with 6 string acoustic "Stella" tuned "A" low bass and if I had my choice to-day I'd still take it over a Maverick.Two or three Mavericks for that matter.
Newcomers.. stay away from Mavericks.
They are well named.

[This message was edited by Roy Thomson on 17 May 2002 at 11:25 AM.]

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 17 May 2002 11:04 am

Say what you wish about the Maverick but while working for Lynn Anderson in the seventys I got very tired of carrying my 96 pound MSA through airports, taxies,small planes all over the world. So I went down to Sho-Bud and paid $200.00 for a used mavrick.
I worked with Lynn part time for over three years on this guitar, made over $100.000 then sold the little Maverick for $300.00, Do I like mavericks? For the correct perpose, YES! I think the tone is fine,On the early model birdseye, raised neck model. Even used it on a couple of major albums in the '70's, Like it? Naw, but it was the best guitar for the job at the time. I would still prefer it to any thing in or near the price range. But then, tone doesn't matter to most folks. By the way, the steel player that replaced my with Lynn,(Doyle Grissom)also used a late model Maverick for over six years, on the road with her. You Maverick bashers need to back up and try to understand that a good Maverick guitar in good playing condition will make you a lot of money dependably, and sound fine in the process.Don't buy one off e-bay and you won't get hurt for a good one.

Bobbe [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 17 May 2002 at 12:10 PM.]

Post by **Joey Ace** » 17 May 2002 11:05 am

I think Mav's sometimes sell high on Ebay because people know the Sho-Bud name. They don't know the difference between a Mav and a Pro Model.

About a year ago, a well know rock guitarist, who own a small local studio asked me to come by and setup a Steel that he just got.

This guy deals in lots of vintage guitars, but knows nothing about Steels. I was disappointed to see his new Steel was a Maverick. I set it up and played it a bit.
I was also taken by how poor the quality was.

I tried to gently explain this. The owner said it's just for "different sounds" in his studio. I advised that any serious Steeler would bring their own anyway.

He asked what I thought it was worth. I related it terms I knew would understand. I said, "It's comparable to a Squire Strat."

He was shocked and showed me his reciept.
He got it at a pawn shop, even trade for a Squire Strat!
[This message was edited by Joey Ace on 17 May 2002 at 12:08 PM.]

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 17 May 2002 11:23 am

I also feel some folks are confusing "poor quality with simplicity". The Maverick is extremly simple, but treated with care, a very usable musical instrument.
We sold seven at Christmas time two years ago for $299.00 each and gave the buyers the opportunity to get all their money back when they decide to trade up. I don't see anyone doing this with it's compitition. Speaking of quality, inexpensive and simple,my vote would be for the GFI mini pro model. A true winner that is being used professionally more and more everyday.
Bobbe.
[This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 17 May 2002 at 12:39 PM.]

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 17 May 2002 11:37 am

What's wrong with a Squier strat?

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 17 May 2002 11:40 am

Not enough pedals.

Post by **Joey Ace** » 17 May 2002 11:44 am

Nothin's wrong with a Squire Strat.
<a href=http://pedalsteel.tv/InstDisk/Pages/Strat.htm>Here's mine.</a>.

It ain't no Les Paul or Tele.
It is what it is. Like Popeye!

patrick donovan · Post by **patrick donovan** » 17 May 2002 11:51 am

Everyone should own a "Maverick"...once. It will make you really appreciate a real steel. I started on a Fender 400..the Maverick was a step up, it had a knee lever..w0w.

Bobbe you would sound good playing a cigar box with strings acrossed it, some of us (me) don't have that kind of talent and need all the help (a good guitar) that we can get.

Mavericks definitely have (had) a place but "it ain't at my house", the Carter Starter is by far the superior instrument.

Regards, Patrick

Michael Holland · Post by **Michael Holland** » 17 May 2002 12:10 pm

paid $200.00 for a used maverick ........ made over $100,000

I think I've spent 100 grand and made about $200!

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 17 May 2002 12:41 pm

It's not a fair comparison, apples and oranges here. late 60's technology and requirements vs a modern available Instrument. Keep in mind a majority of the earliest Sho-Buds had one maybe two knee levers. Some things hadn't evolved yet...Then when they did evolve so did the next generation low end STARTER guitars. This doesn't mean that I think that students should run out and get a Maverick, I think they should not ! My opinion is that anyone starting to learn how to play a Pedal Steel is wasting the cash and time if it is not at least a 3+4 guitar.
tp
tp[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 17 May 2002 at 01:50 PM.]

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 17 May 2002 1:26 pm

There should be a National Maverick Bonfire held once a year so we could rid the world of these planks. I hear they burn realllll good!

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 17 May 2002 1:36 pm

You don't sell Carter-Starters, do you Bobbe?

Like you, I can play a Maverick and make it sound good. Mine's an early raised-neck birdseye model, like yours, and I added a roller nut. I'm not saying that they're not usuable instruments. I'm saying that they aren't good to learn on. Today's lessons assume at least 3 knee levers.

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic) Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6)

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 17 May 2002 1:48 pm

i started out on a Mav' too. (it was'nt the raised neck model) it was a cheezy axe but it got me started. i sure do prefer the Bud i got now. i'm sure the starter models bein' made nowadays are quite a step up compared to the Mavs.
Steel waitin' to be invited to the weenie roast...

Kurt Graber · Post by **Kurt Graber** » 17 May 2002 2:00 pm

Bought a maverick in '82', mastered the Hal Rugg- Weldon Lick with this thing. The tone was pretty good, and I have been hooked on steel ever since. I sold it for what I paid for it probably in '85' some time, and upgraded. Best money I ever spent ( I was 17 at the time and I think it was all the money I had). Laugh if you want, but there is a lot of steel that comes out of 3 pedals and one knee. I invested a lot of enjoyable hours on this thing, and I never remember any tuning problems or string breakage that was out of the ordinary.

Chuck McGill · Post by **Chuck McGill** » 17 May 2002 2:34 pm

If not for the trusty ole Maverick I would
never have started playing steel. So I am with the Bobster
on his post. Nothing against the Carter. I've found them to be very good instruments
but that first starter steel I learned to play on and played my first gigs with will
allways be the one I remember.The Maverick!
Affordable to everyone.

Ray Rasmussen · Post by **Ray Rasmussen** » 17 May 2002 3:58 pm

Since we're on the subject... I have a Sho-Bud S10 with 3 pedals and 1 knee that has a raised neck, birdseye maple finish, roller nut, and is double raise double lower. It does not say "Maverick" or "Pro 1" on it. Any ideas what this could be? Did Sho-Bud make a model between the two?

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 17 May 2002 4:03 pm

Confucius say...

"Only the most foolish hitch-hiker would berate the tattered vehicle that might give him a ride"

(Or maybe that was Charlie Chan?)

Anyway, as a kid, many a' night I'd go to bed...and wish I had something as good as a Maverick![This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 17 May 2002 at 05:04 PM.]

erik · Post by **erik** » 17 May 2002 4:23 pm

I looked into getting a steel a few years back. I found that the GFI student model was available in the Day setup. That would make it a more versatile choice.

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 17 May 2002 6:10 pm

Erik, Yessir! A few (very few) dollars more will get you a LOT better guitar(GFI). Bobby Lee, sell the Carter Starter? Haven't even seen one, however I'm sure they are just as fine quality as anything this company makes. All the regular music stores sell them in Nashville, We cater to a different market.
I just don't understand all this Mavrick bashing,Sho-Bud did not build this guitar themselves but contracted it out to a cabinet manufacturing company in Conway Ar.
Sho-Bud did this to make it possible for the less fortunate to be at least, able to get a steel guitar and get started. I bless them for that.The people that say it was "worse than nothing" have a lot a nerve, short on professional knowledge, and needed to see the check stubs that Doyle Grissom and I got because of playing this 14 pound, good sounding, dependable little money making workhorse. I really wish I had more to sell and start more folks on the path to fun, money and all the other perks I have enjoyed being a professional musician. I would LOVE to see everyone play a pro guitar, and learn on a pro guitar, BUT---I don't feel that someone that has progressed beyond this guitar and moved up the ladder should look back and bash this guitar just because he is now able to afford a pro guitar. I never see "old pro" airline pilots or military fighter pilots putting down or laughing at The little "Piper Cub". As a matter of fact, a lot of them own one, for fun.
As far as John and Ann building this starter guitar themselves as has been stated previously, I think they also have contracted the manufacture of this guitar out and they are just the distributers.The preceding is a false rumor! I'm closing this topic. -b0b- If anyone cares to clear this up, I'd be happy to be corrected if wrong. And also , yes, I feel this is a great move forward for the industry, any steel guitar that is a good playable guitar should be looked upon as a move for the good and a move in the right direction. I also commend this company for taking up this slack in our ever growing market place. I wish them VERY well, as I would and will, anyone helping the industry.
But,Maverick bashing? I don't think so. They still have a place in the industry. Just don't pay to much, stay away from e-bay. Remember, Sho-Bud didn't make most of them. So don't let the name fool you.

Bobbe (love all steels) Seymour

P.S.
By the way, I would love to buy a few Mavericks, www.steelguitar.net
If they are so bad, you better call me quick and get rid of them!!!!![This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 17 May 2002 at 07:16 PM.][This message was edited by b0b on 18 May 2002 at 01:05 PM.]