Playing without slides and bends

Pete Grant · Post by **Pete Grant** » 2 May 2002 7:01 am

When I was playing honky-tonks, every once in a while I'd challenge myself to play an entire solo without playing a sliding or bending note, just to see if I could develop that much control, and still be able to play something pretty and interesting.

When I first tried it, I couldn't get all the way through 12 or 16 measures. I had to work on it at home a bunch before I could actually do a whole solo. It was a fun exercise, and I haven't done it for years, but think I'll try it again today.

Anybody ever tried it? Did it drive you mad?

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 2 May 2002 7:17 am

I know what you are talking about. I didn't take up the "pedal" steel to be able to pump the pedals for "that" sound. I took it up to be able to get the full chords. I play what I guess you'd call "chordal melody". I like to be able to play all the notes of the chord, if at all possible. I have recently gone to the C6th neck for more of the same.

Uff-Da!

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 2 May 2002 7:41 am

Yes, I do that often. Other steelers have criticized me for it, but I hold the opinion that a slide is a musical statement, and sometimes that statement is inappropriate.

I once was performing Bach's Minuet in G for some folks in my living room. The piece as I arranged it has no slides, except for an "optional" one at the end of the first section. I played the optional slide the second time I played that section, and got a "giggle" from my daughter.

When I asked her about it later, she said she laughed because she suddenly realized that the music was being played on a "country music" instrument. That's what the sliding note said to her - that's the statement it made.

You can slide a lot in country, rock, and blues, but when you step into other genres you have to be very careful about it. The sliding sound is very much associated with country and blues. When you inject it into classical, jazz or new age music, it's all too easy to make an intended style shift.

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
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Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 2 May 2002 8:26 am

Sneaky Pete has that trick down to a fine art.Check out "Sleepy Lagoon" on his 1979 solo LP where he plays the tune very Hawaiian and then takes a "guitar" solo on steel.It sounds like his steel suddenly grew frets for a verse and chorus. -MJ-

Pete Grant · Post by **Pete Grant** » 2 May 2002 8:38 am

Unlike Ernest Bovine's other steel guitar which actually does have frets!

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 2 May 2002 8:42 am

I took the frets off the Sho-Bud many years ago so that I could have a C6 again. But recently I got a GFI 12/8 string with a frets on the 8 string. Unfortunately I am so busy reading about hippies taking over the Grand Ole Opry here on the Forum that I don't have time to practice the fretted style.

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 2 May 2002 12:22 pm

This is great practice and Tom Brumley is an advocate on this technique when needed.
Practice this with no bending of notes by pedals or slide sounds with bar(e9th).
<pre>
3.___________________________10_10b
4.___________________10______10_10~
5.______3a_3_________10_10a__10_10a
6._3_3b_3b_3__10_10b____10b________
7.___3___________10________________
8._3__________10___________________
</pre>

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Ricky Davis

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[This message was edited by Ricky Davis on 03 May 2002 at 01:50 AM.]

Pete Grant · Post by **Pete Grant** » 2 May 2002 2:33 pm

That was one of the hardest techniques to get used to--going from pedals to no pedals on some or all of the same strings. I found that harder than not sliding when I move the bar.[This message was edited by Pete Grant on 02 May 2002 at 03:34 PM.]

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 2 May 2002 4:39 pm

I do this quite often. It's an interesting exercise, and when done right, it transforms the "character" of the steel into something closer to piano or organ. It's a great way to "comp" behind someone else, too. Like anything else, the glisses, bends, slurs, and trills can become almost cliches when overdone. These very unique capabilities of the PSG are what some people dislike most, so it's helpful to throw in new techniques from time to time.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 2 May 2002 5:56 pm

Pete-I have usually always played without slides, except when I did a little hawaiian music. (But I played the standard slides and licks when I played with a "country " band, when I had to)

Donnny-I , too, tried to play pop standards like a piano would, I used to have (heaven forbid!) a Leslie too.....al

Brian Herder · Post by **Brian Herder** » 3 May 2002 4:41 pm

Michael, that Sneaky Pete tune is one of my all time favorites..and it's funny (to me, anyway) that Ricky mentions the Tom Brumley thing. Just this afternoon, I was listening to one of my favorite Brumley things..Rick Nelson's "One Night Stand". ..and I was noticing how little he slides and bends the notes..so clean, and perfect ..and what a tone. Two great examples.

Ray Rasmussen · Post by **Ray Rasmussen** » 5 May 2002 9:55 pm

I think it's interesting how guitar players are adding B-benders and bending notes and steel players are discussing not using pedals or sliding notes. I think slides and bends are part of the appeal of the pedal steel and one of the reasons I'm trying to learn how to play the darn thing.

Ray Rasmussen

Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 6 May 2002 2:54 am

Ditto Brian...great Ricky/Stone Canyon song.
Just flawless TB stuff. Lyrics and melody aren't bad either. Yup, one of my 'all-times'
too.

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 6 May 2002 6:59 am

When you are trying to make a pedal steel sound like a dobro (with a match bro or super bro), you have to be able to clean up the pedal sound.

Erv

Andy Volk · Post by **Andy Volk** » 6 May 2002 7:03 am

Hey, Rickey

Would you mind posting that excercise in a non-pedal tuning? Thanks.

Pete Grant · Post by **Pete Grant** » 6 May 2002 7:53 am

One place where that technique is useful is when you're playing with two steels in a band. I used to love playing twin steels with Bobby Black, and once Buddy Cage and I shredded some tunes with the NRPS. It's really great fun, but you do find yourself bending less.

Another time that technique is useful is when the guitar player you're playing with is used to playing without a steel in the band, and--complete with volume pedal--does his/her very best to sound like a steel with every bend imaginable. I've been there and it's really quite entertaining. It's like, "OK, I'll be the guitar tonight."

Pete Grant · Post by **Pete Grant** » 6 May 2002 8:09 am

Andy,

If you don't already have a map of your fingerboard in scale steps (1 through 7) then make one. The pedal exercise is in G and that's a good one to know. Then:

Start on your--these are scale steps--1 & 3 strings (if you're in D, that's strings 4 and 3; for G it's 3 and 2 or 6 and 5). If you're in G in D tuning, you'll be on the 5th fret. Then go to the next strings up and back 2 frets (3 and 2 at the 3rd fret for D)to catch the 2 and 4 scale steps. And so on.

Scale-wise the exercise is: 1&3, 2&4, 4&6, 3&5, 5&7, 6&1, 2&5, 1&3, 5&1&3, 6&1&4.

For non-pedal, you can avoid slants entirely.

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 6 May 2002 1:24 pm

Hey Andy; Pete pretty much explained the tab I was gunn put up for your non-pedal run on that particular deal.
Actually I use bar slants but that will play just fine.
Ricky

Mike Cass · Post by **Mike Cass** » 7 May 2002 7:40 pm

yep, definitley the next frontier!
The first one to perfect that technique with speed & cleanliness will have all the chops they need to bop till they drop,in addition to classical & anything else one might imagine. What a discipline though..getting the chops up to speed!
Tal Farlow said of his start with Red Norvo that, in the beginning he couldnt hang, but with about i month? of 10-12 hr a day practice sessions it finally came & his playing speaks for itself. Might take a bit longer on the steel, tho. I wish I had the time to devote to that endeavor

cool thread Pete, thanks!
mc

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 7 May 2002 10:45 pm

Yes, I do that often. Other steelers have criticized me for it, but I hold the opinion that a slide is a musical statement, and sometimes that statement is inappropriate.

I couldn't agree more, when a pedal squeeze is used out of context, it sounds like a novelty or a gimmick. It's the difference between playing the steel as an instrument or demonstrating what it does.