Be careful who you buy a used pedal steel from.

Mike Cass · Post by **Mike Cass** » 15 Jan 2002 10:24 pm

erasing my post...thanx for the email Bobbe... Peter,good luck.
[This message was edited by Mike Cass on 15 January 2002 at 11:21 PM.]

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 18 Jan 2002 9:30 am

Hello Ed,
We will not disassemble the changer and clean it as discussed. Thanks.

Ed,you mentioned on the forum, that you think you have everything together that we need.
You also mentioned on the forum that you would help getting us the parts at no charge.
I am very grateful for this great gesture.

The parts needed are:
-Two nylon bushes that hold the cross shafts.
-One metal block that functions as the LKL stop and holds the nylon cross shaft bush as well.
-One set of replacement roller nuts, including the axel.
-2 replacement GOTOH tuning keys for string 2 and 3.
-A couple of spare collars to lock the rods to the bellcranks.
-A die and spare nylon tuning nuts to make my own rods.

Please let me know what will happen next.
Many thanks again for the great gesture.

Peter den Hartogh

Tom Keller · Post by **Tom Keller** » 18 Jan 2002 11:49 pm

I have been dealing with Gruhn since the 1970's and have had no problems. Just this month returned a $2000.00 resonator guitar on 24 hour approval.

Bob Schaedler · Post by **Bob Schaedler** » 19 Jan 2002 12:15 pm

Is it George himself, or someone else running the store now?

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 20 Jan 2002 1:55 pm

Hi all,
here is a follow-up on the George Gruhn story...

1-George Gruhn has paid $250 towards repairs.
2-I am still waiting for Ed Naylor to send me the parts he promised.
3-All pedals and levers have been moved back to their original position and work with a nice positive action.

Now I have some questions: I have cleaned the disconnected changer as much as possible. I find that the changer movements are very stiff. Is this normal, or do the changer fingers have to move freely without any resistance? Could it be that the changer is "packed" too tightly. Should I remove one teflon washer? I also find that string 10 and 11 are stiffer than the higher strings.
Any help is appreciated.

The pickup is a humbucker with 2 coils next to each other. The 24 polepieces are adjustable with grubscrews. It is a sidemount pickup with 4 screws. It has a centertap and a good sound. Does anyone know what brand this is?
Thanks again.
Peter den Hartogh
Cape Town SA

[This message was edited by Peter on 20 January 2002 at 02:01 PM.][This message was edited by Peter on 20 January 2002 at 02:06 PM.]

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 20 Jan 2002 3:01 pm

Changer movements should not be stiff.
Maybe the extra washer is squeezing it tightly.
Let's hope that the fingers haven't been samshed out of shape, making them hard to rotate.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 30 Jan 2002 10:31 am

This is for Ed Naylor:

Please respond to my numerous email messages.
Thanks
Peter

Ed Naylor · Post by **Ed Naylor** » 30 Jan 2002 11:05 am

For some reason you may not have received my E-Mails. I NEED AN ADDRESS so I can send your parts. Ed

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 2 Mar 2002 11:46 pm

Hi Ed Naylor, on the Forum you generously offered to send me free parts for the "Remington" U12.
In January I gave you details which parts were needed and my address.
It is now March and I have not heard from you. I did not receive anything either.
Please respond to my email and let me know what is happening.
Best Regards
Peter den Hartogh

Many thanks again for the great gesture.
[This message was edited by Peter on 09 March 2002 at 11:37 PM.]

Ray Montee · Post by **Ray Montee** » 3 Mar 2002 11:39 am

It would appear that we're having a communication problem.......?

Jody Carver · Post by **Jody Carver** » 3 Mar 2002 2:17 pm

I bought my first guitar off of a man who was
trying to sell off an unknown line of guitars
He wore a "rumpled" suit and needed a shave.

He was told by the store owner Eddie Bell (then a big Gibson Dealer)NYC to leave the store.
I followed him down the street,,and lo and behold,,he was carrying a funny looking triple neck guitar with a name I have never
heard before,,,the name was FENDER. This was
used as a sample and was defective as far as
the pickups were concerned. It was then that
I wrote to this company Radio-Television Equipment Co, and spoke to a Donald D. Randall. He explained that this was a salesman's sample. From that moment on,,,my life was changed.All because I bought a used
guitar from an unknown person and a never heard of company.

The mans name was Jack Douglas,,obviously trying to sell Fender guitars and finding it very difficult if not "impossible".

If it were not for Jack Douglas,,,I would have never known Leo Fender and Donald Randall,,,,so you see,,,not all stories are
"tales of Horror. This was my LIFE's beginning. To BE Continued in my "Upcoming Fender Book" and many more,,,

The year????
1948. The Time?? The Right Time.

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Copyright(c) 2002 by
Jody Carver "All Rights
Reserved[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 03 March 2002 at 05:18 PM.]

Ed Naylor · Post by **Ed Naylor** » 3 Mar 2002 5:15 pm

My computer has been down for the past 3 weeks. Your parts are on the way. Ed

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 3 Mar 2002 6:24 pm

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http://hometown.aol.com/damirzanne/damirzanne1.html
[This message was edited by Damir Besic on 04 March 2002 at 07:07 AM.][This message was edited by Damir Besic on 04 March 2002 at 07:08 AM.]

Post by **b0b** » 3 Mar 2002 7:27 pm

Actually, Gruhn made good on their promise. Their mistake has been corrected to the customer's satisfaction (and mine

). They did the right thing in the end.

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<img align=left src="http://b0b.com/coolb0b2.gif" border="0">
 -b0b- quasar@b0b.com 
-System Administrator

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 4 Mar 2002 6:46 am

This matter has long since been settled. The prior owner of this guitar who
had it before we did was Steel Guitar Works who conformed that the
instrument was in good condition. The South African customer who received
it wanted it set up for a different tuning and did not know how to set it up
himself. The correspondence posted that you have shown me does not show the
messages from Ed Naylor at Steel Guitar Works who conformed that he was very
familiar with this instrument. The matter has long since been resolved. We
do not claim to be specialists in steel guitars, but we certainly did not
deliberately misrepresent this or any other instrument. If you choose not
to deal with us due to "information" such as this posted on unregulated web
sites that is OK by me.

George Gruhn

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http://hometown.aol.com/damirzanne/damirzanne1.html

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 4 Mar 2002 6:58 am

This was an Email from the Gruhn guitars to me.I`m posting that here because it`s fair.I received few Emails where guys from the forum explained to me that it wasn`t Mr.Gruhn`s fault.I see the whole picture now and I`m not suprised at all.I appologize to mr.Gruhn and taking back what I said.
Sincerely,Damir Besic

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http://hometown.aol.com/damirzanne/damirzanne1.html

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 4 Mar 2002 8:52 am

Damir, you are a good man! George, so are you.

Bobbe

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 5 Mar 2002 12:19 pm

Damir, thank you for forwarding Mr Gruhns Email. Unfortunately the information is misleading.

Ed Naylor phoned mr Gruhn and told him that the guitar was in perfect working order. This was not true. It is because of this phonecall that Mr Gruhn did not want to make good on his deal. All he was prepared to do is pay $250 for repairs.

The South African customer (me) received a guitar that could not hold its tuning at all, because the changer was completely gunged up. Then some of the pedals were not connected at all. The guitar pedals played extremely heavy. Then it was not possible to play on the first few frets because one of the roller nuts was the wrong size. It was clear that this guitar had been mistreated. It also became clear WHO mistreated it. This person is doing everything in his power to tell everyone that this guitar is fine (obviously because he worked on it).

The South African victim wanted to "change the tuning". This again is a misleading statement. He just wanted to put the guitar back in its original condition and setup. The fact that this guitar has been mistreated meant that he had to strip it completely and rebuild it. It is not surprising that he had to obtain information from the forum how to do this.

The forum members have been absolute stars with their support and advice. Thank you all! You are incredible! It is for this reason that the South African customer asked Mr Gruhn to send his $250 to the Forum as a donation. This he has done (see b0b's smiley above). Thank you Mr Gruhn. And thank you b0b.

We know NOW(!) that Mr Gruhn is not a specialist in steel guitars, but it was pretty clear that even a novice could see that this guitar was not working. Much later, AFTER the deal was done, a Gruhn staff member sent an email to the customer in which he admitted that he quoted a very high shipping cost to discourage the purchase. Why would he have done such a thing? You draw your own conclusions about pre-meditation.

The guitar is still not in a playable condition. However, THANKS TO THE SUPPORT OF THIS FORUM this guitar may be in good playing condition soon. This has been a long ordeal (3 months) and the victim has learned an awful lot about the mechanics of his guitar.

Jody, thank you for your wonderful story and your previous support.

Ed Naylor has promised to send parts to South Africa for NO CHARGE AT ALL.
(He stated above that he has sent them. I have not yet received the parts.)

Hope this makes everybody see the whole picture.

Peter
(copies of relevant emails are available on request)

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 9 Mar 2002 11:39 pm

Sorry b0b, I still have an upside down PSG as an ornament in my living room. According to a number of forumites this PSG is NOT a Remington, but a forgery. I had to accept a lousy $250 for repair costs because I had no other option. How satisfied do you think I am? Based on the details of this transaction I repeat: "Be careful who you buy a used pedal steel from".

-Peter-

[This message was edited by Peter on 10 March 2002 at 07:23 AM.]

Ed Naylor · Post by **Ed Naylor** » 10 Mar 2002 6:27 am

Peter- I am very upset about your post calling the Remington a "Fake".It happens that I know the whole history of the guitar. I got it in trade from the original owner.I sold it and got it back in trade on anothr guitar. I again sold it but added a couple pedals for the new owner. I have been in this business 35 years and to my knowledge never sold a "Fake" guitar. The parts I gave to you are on the way. I feel you owe the forumites an apology. Ed Naylor Steel Guitar Works

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 10 Mar 2002 7:48 am

Ed, thank you again for your great gesture. I am waiting with anticipation.

Ed, I am sorry about my clumsy wording. But from your own description it is clear that this guitar has been bouncing backwards and forwards between owners. As you probably know a good playable instrument usually stays with its happy owner. However, this guitar somehow made its owners want to get rid of it. And, as I discovered, for a very good reason (read this topic). Obviously I do not know what happened to the guitar when it left your shop.

With regards to the authenticity of this guitar, I suggest you take this up with all the forumites who declared that this guitar is not a Remington. I am sure you know who they are, so there is no need for me to pass on this information.

Best Regards and thanks again,
Peter

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 10 Mar 2002 7:55 am

"I have been in this business 35 years and to my knowledge never sold a "Fake" guitar"

yeah Peter,appologize,what do you think you can get for $1200?a steel guitar?
Damir Besic
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http://hometown.aol.com/damirzanne/damirzanne1.html
[This message was edited by Damir Besic on 10 March 2002 at 08:01 AM.]

Ed Naylor · Post by **Ed Naylor** » 10 Mar 2002 8:23 am

Just to clarify things. The original owner traded to me to get a D10.A common practice. The next buyer had a S10 beginner Fender that I initially upgraded to a 3/4. He kept it and bought the Remington. He decided on a new Maple body guitar and traded back to me. Again a normal move. I then sold it outright to a s10 MSA owner and added a couple pedals and knees that he wanted. Another normal transaction. I even added a new Lawrence Pickup. In the year and a half since I last saw this guitar I can't beleive it "Deteriorated" so badly in this time frame. You got a bargain and don't realize it. ED

B.Jenkins · Post by **B.Jenkins** » 10 Mar 2002 9:15 am

Ed naylor;
After reading the post on this steel, and you telling him that he got a good deal, How can that be, if it has to have a match stick under a roller to hold it up??????????
If he plays any hot licks, it will ingnite and there goes the whole thing up in smoke......
Billy........

Ed Naylor · Post by **Ed Naylor** » 10 Mar 2002 10:21 am

In all my years of working on guitars I have never seen "1" roller wear so bad it had to be elevated with a matchstick.The strings that are"pulled" can wear over a period of years. I have worked on old guitars 30 yrs old and never been lubed and they seldom have enough wear to need replacing. Oh well-------it is subjects like this one that keeps people watching the forum for latest news.Ed