ETS Pictures

[Ken Byng]

The only model they've advertised so far is a single 10. See http://steelguitaruniverse.com/.

I don't think it would be a good idea to try to start a company with a bunch of different models at once. The S-10 model is expandable to 5+5. There's a lot of musical power and versatility in this simple design.

True, but there is no option for a lightweight fly-guitar for guys like me who play 12 string instruments. The Simmons, Stage one, Legend (Formerly Carpsteel) and now this one are only available as 10 stringers.

If one of these companies made a 12 stringer, they would corner the market.

Mike - are you sure on that? I reckon b0b is right - know your market and aim for that sector. There are considerably more 10 string E9 players around than 12 string players of any tuning. Next question - how many 12 string players want fly guitars? You are an obvious potential customer, but ETS are not going to expand outside of the main core area of 10 string E9 yet awhile. I don't blame them as tooling costs are very high for other options with lower potential turnover.

[b0b]

I believe that the world-wide market for all new S-12 pedal steels is less than 100 per year. I could be wrong, but not by much.

[Mike Perlowin]

I believe that the world-wide market for all new S-12 pedal steels is less than 100 per year. I could be wrong, but not by much.

Bobby, I don't know how big or small the market for S-12s may be, but surely the fact that so many of the major builders (Mullen, Zum, Williams, Carter, MSA Infinity etc) make them indicates that there are enough 12 players to justify somebody making an ultra-light one similar to the ETS or Legend (formerly Carpsteel.)

I think a survey of how many of us play 12 strings is worthy of another thread.

[b0b]

A better survey might ask how many have bought a new S-12 in the past 5 years. Most S-12 players today are playing old guitars and will never buy a new one.

In string sales (my only real indicator), 10-string E9th sets outnumber U-12 sets by about 9 to 1. Less than 1000 new pedal steels are made each year. That's the basis for my estimate.

[Tom Wolverton]

Bob, et al -

I was wondering if the all alu body exhibits detectible thermal expansion. I could see a large temp swing on a stage causing some tuning issues. The CTE of aluminum is quite a bit higher than wood. Anyone notice this, or is it a non-problem?

Also, Bob, is it possible to put your 8-string Desert Rose D6th tuning on this guitar with 5+5 (and use the extra 2 strings) ?

[Mike Perlowin]

Bobby, while it's true that 10 string players outnumber 12 string players, I believe that there are enough of us to justify some company coming out with a lightweight 12 string fly guitar.

Granted, if they all did, there would not enough sales to make it worthwhile for any of them, but if just one did, and had the monopoly on them, I think they would do well.

Right now, there is nothing like the ETS available for those who of us who use 12 strings.

[b0b]

Bob, et al -

I was wondering if the all alu body exhibits detectible thermal expansion. I could see a large temp swing on a stage causing some tuning issues. The CTE of aluminum is quite a bit higher than wood. Anyone notice this, or is it a non-problem?

Also, Bob, is it possible to put your 8-string Desert Rose D6th tuning on this guitar with 5+5 (and use the extra 2 strings) ?

Hi Tom,

I've had thermal expansion tuning issues on my Sierra guitars (also aluminum) when the temperature changed radically during the course of a gig, but I've had the same issue with wood guitars (Williams and Desert Rose). I think it's just the nature of the beast. Ed Packard did some tests a few years ago that demonstrated how, once a guitar stabilizes at any given temperature, it will settle back into tune. His tests were on a Sierra. The problem occurs only during the temperature change. When all of the parts have acclimated, the guitar will be in tune.

And yes, the ETS S-10 will support my D6th copedent. When I decide which of the trio I'm going to keep, I intend to prove it.

Mike, if you're traveling a lot maybe you should consider switching to an S-10 to lighten your load.

[Fred Glave]

Those are very pretty guitars. Since I just purchased a brand new Stage One, I noticed some similarities. The size and weight are identical, as well as the hardshell case appears identical to the Stage One. The Stage One copendent cannot be modified easily, nor can additional pedals or levers be added easily. But on the other hand, the ETS is twice the price. Without seeing or playing the ETS all I can do is comment on the ability to expand on pedals and levers and copedent, which is significant in some respect. bOb, have you ever played a Stage One? What would some of the other advantages be? I'd sure like to find another utra-light 10 string set up for C6th.

[b0b]

I've never seen or played a Stage One, but my understanding is that it's a beginner's guitar with a simple pull-release changer. Correct? And it doesn't support the 6th string lower, which has become a standard change over the past 20 years.

The ETS S-10 has an all-pull, triple raise, triple lower changer with split tuning capability. The undercarriage is very much like a Carter pro model (duh!), and it has that same smooth action that the Carter had. This isn't designed as a student instrument - it's really a lightweight pro guitar.

[Tom Wolverton]

thanks Bob. BTW is that the ETS red or burgandy color on that one in your photos?

[Fred Glave]

Yes bOb, the Stage One comes with the tuning as-is. Now that doesn't necessarily mean that it cannot be modified to lower 6th string G#, or 9th string D, or even add a lever or pedal to split a tuning or whatever. It only means that Stage One doesn't offer the parts or service to do it. The owner would take it on themselves or with a steel tech/mechanic. To tell you the truth I don't really know the difference between an all-pull changer and a simple pull changer. What I do know is that the Stage One is a very pleasant steel to play in terms of ease and response of pedals, levers, and tone. It is a high quality grab and go guitar. For a person who wants the ability to change their copedent quickly and easily, the Stage One is definitely not going to compete. The ETS looks like a beauty and Mr. Carter has always been involved in high quality products. I'd like to hear a sound clip, but would rather sit down to one and give it a test drive!

[b0b]

The one in my pictures is burgundy, but it looks brighter because the pictures were outdoors under a bright sky.

[Joey Ace]

I'd like to hear a sound clip

Here ya go:
http://youtu.be/Vf5zBQrGkkA

[Fred Glave]

Thanks for the link Joey. Al plays nicely. The guitar looks like a pleasure to play. Nice tone. I love the look of the rounded corners of the body. I guess the aluminum body allows for the shaping of the edges like a wood body, and the clean look of formica.