My view on this years ISGA

[Jerry Overstreet]

I'm a long time attendee of the ISGC starting somewhere around 1978. I believe that the conventions of the days at the Chase and early Clarion/Millennium are gone forever.

Organizers and promoters, vendors and many performers are not spring chickens anymore. Times change and years take their toll as well. Perhaps some input from fresh minds would be in order.

The days when Buddy, Jimmy, Speedy, Julian and guys like that would come out of those bars on Fri, Sat nites and just blow the roof off the place are no more. True, those players are gone or can no longer participate, but there seemed to be more of an entertainment penchant then.

I'm sure most of their programs were planned and rehearsed, but for the most part, they did not seem slick and polished to the point that you would think that.

Nowadays, it seems that many of the players come out and play their latest CD. Nothing wrong with trying to make sales as they're not getting rich on the performing compensation.
It seems to me that the chosen material is less diverse and leans a lot heavier toward country music whereas in the past, players might choose an unexpected direction.

Those days of uninhibited versatility seem to be missing in the last few years.

Yes, after attending so many of them, one does get a bit jaded. Still, I don't think there is the same energy and liveliness as before.

I think the mini-concerts in the vendor's side rooms are a bad idea. Scotty used to think so too, as he would come around and hush down those crowds from time to time.

I can't imagine why anyone would want to come to this event where the world's finest steel guitarists are showing off their expertise in the ballroom, yet watch shows in the side rooms that you can see any Saturday night at any country music jamboree.

They go on any time of day or night. A potential buyer can't get to the vendor's stage to try out one of his guitars because of vendor's endorsers jamming or mini shows. Lots of people go to this convention cash in hand to buy a guitar....I'd think the vendor's would know this and make it convenient for them to sample their wares. You should not have to ask to try one, they should be made available for you. Many are shy and would like to try one in relative solitude.

I agree about not having splinter events going on other places while the main ballroom stage is on. Those should be worked in at other times that wouldn't interfere with what's going on in there.

I don't go to the steel guitar convention to see singers or other instrumentalists either, I go to watch the best of the best honk on steel guitar. That's what it should be about. If vocalists are scheduled as part of the entertainment on the main stage, they should be someone of world class note. With all due respect to the fine vocalists that do perform and players who include a vocalist as part of their program.

I don't think the fiddle, guitar and piano should be an automatic ride in every tune either. Some great supporting musicians and they understand the steel guitar should be king here.

I had plans to go this year, but it didn't work out. I wanted to catch up on my gear "possibles" and check out the latest stuff, but maybe next year....

So what do I know, it's still the only show of this magnitude and caliber, so go if you can.

Those are some of my thoughts and reasons I'm ambivalent about attending every year, so come on, let me have it.

[Earnest Bovine]

It seems to me that the chosen material is less diverse ...whereas in the past, players might choose an unexpected direction.

I agree; it's too much of the same thing.

A potential buyer can't get to the vendor's stage to try out one of his guitars because of vendor's endorsers jamming or mini shows. Lots of people go to this convention cash in hand to buy a guitar....I'd think the vendor's would know this and make it convenient for them to sample their wares. You should not have to ask to try one,

Yes, I agree 100%

I agree about not having splinter events going on other places while the main ballroom stage is on. Those should be worked in at other times that wouldn't interfere with what's going on in there.

I disagree here. Other simultaneous events are OK with me. Having too many choices is a good thing.

I don't go to the steel guitar convention to see singers or other instrumentalists either, I go to watch the best of the best honk on steel guitar...I don't think the fiddle, guitar and piano should be an automatic ride in every tune either.

Yes, let the steel player hog the show. That's what we came to hear.

[Herby Wallace]

Jerry, I agree on most of what you said. I have played the Convention every year since 1978 and I have enjoyed every one, but the magic is not the same as it once was when Buddy Emmons, Jimmy Day, Curly Chalker and all the legend players were there. Of course, that is no one's fault, it's just the way it is. I know when you mentioned the side rooms, the real reason they were started years ago was where a potential buyer could try out a new guitar if he was in the market, and I agree that many players are to shy to sit and try a guitar with the jamming going on all the time. Like I said, these rooms were started years ago simply because a customer couldn't try a guitar in the main ballroom with the show going on. Now Mullen actually has two side rooms, one to demo in and another for jamming, but most of the other companies just have one and again most of the time it is jamming so you can't really sit down and try a guitar like it used to be. I have already stated that I too think there shouldn't be other side shows going on at the same time making a person having to make a choice and taking away from the main show. As to singers, I agree as most of the time at St. Louis or Dallas I only get a singer up when it is someone like Curtis Potter or Johnny Bush. I did have a good buddy of mine from SC who is a great singer, sit in and do one song on Friday night and one on Saturday night, but I only got him up because we are friends and he never had the chance to sing at the Convention. I do have a problem with sometimes giving the band too many solos which happened to me this year on Friday night as I only had time to do 4 songs. Stoney who was the MC then told me that I talked too much and gave to many solos to other instruments, so I am guilty of that. Anyhow, I will shut up again as I always get carried away, but I hope to make every Convention I can as long as I am physically able, and I still enjoy every one, but it is different.

Herby Wallace

[Jim Cohen]

I always try to arrange my tunes live on-stage the same way I would arrange them on a recording, which means having the steel play the heads and one or two choruses of solos, but also letting the other players solo, for a few reasons. Firstly, the ears need a break from nonstop steel guitar (or any other instrument) and by giving them that break, your re-entrance in the tune is all the more effective. Secondly, the guys in the house band are killer players and it's a joy to turn them loose and listen to them. I have always thought that the audience enjoyed hearing them as much as I did; I still think that's true of the majority, but obviously not for everyone.

I think one has to strike the right balance in these things, and that's the art of arranging. But I would never arrange, for a recording, 30 minutes of non-stop steel guitar music that wasn't broken up by some other instrument(s) sharing the tune; it would get too boring, no matter how good the player is. And I think that shouldn't be done on live stage shows either. But, sure, it's possible to over-do anything, and it's possible that sometimes the band might be given "too many" choruses to solo over and some in the audience get impatient waiting for the steel to come back in. In fact, that's the only reason why I usually don't include the fiddle player (when there is one) in my sets at steel shows; it's not because I don't like fiddle or the fiddler (David Russell is great). It's only because I do feel a kind of 'obligation' to give all the soloists on stage a piece of the action (though not necessarily on every song). But still, with one more soloist up there, I'll probably find that I can't play as many tunes as I had hoped to play (like Herby experienced this year at ISGC).

[Tony Prior]

The thread has taken an interesting turn regarding sets and arranging. The thing about it for me is that if there are 20 players in each days "stage show" does this mean that each of the 20 players gives each band member a solo in each song ? Well..yes that is the case...It can get weary...and it does. I would rather see a player just play a verse or two, improvise on one , do a full band TURN Around and be done, move on to the next song. I suspect that some folks are heading OUT of the big room from being weary...This is not about the players on the stage but rather how predictable each set can be.

If the guys have a 30 minute set that's effectively 8 songs ( or so) and if each band member plays a solo in every song that probably equates to 1.5 min of Steel playing for each song, X8 is 12 min out of each 30 min set.


Imagine if Jimbeax or Herby just played a SOLO set... turn the world upside down ! I love it all but sometimes ALL is too much.


Regarding the rooms, I too found it to be odd over the years, IT APPEARS that only vendor booth that was actually set up for people to sit , play and evaluate was Carter. The other rooms, as nice as the Instruments and vendors were, really appeared to be more about about the jams and the player that may be endorsing them.


Seeing Steels up on tables really does nothing for the guy or gal with $4000 in their pocket. Seeing 3 players jamming on a stage with a room full of spectators does nothing for the person who may actually be there to sit behind an Instrument to evaluate it. Many times a novice may decide NOT to sit behind an Instrument with a room full of experienced players.

Don't get me wrong, I love the jams but that's a small show, not a sales presentation. If an Instrument manufacturer goes home with no sales or no orders, that's a bad weekend, all they did was rent a room, travel several hundred miles and pay all expenses to sponsor a jam.

Please don't flame me here,my comment does not imply that other vendors did not take time during the day to work with a prospect, I'm sure they did. I too spoke with several but getting behind an Instrument was always a chore, if even possible.

Scotty's is still a great event regardless...

[Herby Wallace]

One more quick response and I will shut up. As Jim mentioned giving the other instruments solos is the same way I feel. Musically, it makes me play better if the piano or guitar play a great solo as we actually end up playing off each other and too having excellent musicians on stage, I do want to take advantage of that. I agree that musically it would be very boring if it was solid steel, so I probably won't change but like I said when I played Friday night and only was able to get in 4 songs it bothered me, but Stoney who was doing the MC work and keeping up with the time told me that I shouldn't give so many solos and I know that I probably talk too much, but that is just the way it is.

Herby Wallace

[Jack Stoner]

Since this has taken a different turn, I'll chime in.

1. I agree that the vendor display rooms should be for potential buyers to try out the instruments, or amps, not to have a "name" Steeler or Steelers there putting on a show. I know what the guitars sound like from hearing them played on the "big stage", but if I was interested in that brand I should be able to try it out in the vendor's room.

2. I also agree with Herby that giving breaks to the band is better. Although I wanted to hear Herby, Buddy or whoever I also used to wait to hear what Bobby Caldwell was going to do on a song and for the rest of the bands breaks.

[Tony Prior]

One more quick response and I will shut up.

I am very interested in what you have to say, please never shut up !

t

[Jerry Overstreet]

I did not say there should not be solos from other instruments. What I said was not all the other instruments should be given solos on every tune. There are times for trading off and times when straight steel is best.

I understand about getting a break and playing off each other. I do this myself when I play shows. It'd be a sad spectacle if there were no supporting musicians.

Ultimately, it's up to the player in the spotlight. If they want to play all instrumentals, mix it up with vocalists, or just play backup the whole set. This was the freedom I expressed to every performer when I was scheduling entertainment for our local steel show.

I was merely stating things that I like or dislike personally as a spectator.

Sorry, if I'm the one who took the thread to another track, I thought I was continuing earlier discussion.

I wasn't there this year, so I probably should not have made any comments on Nick's original post. Cheers everybody.

[Jack Stoner]

I wasn't there either, Jerry and I was close by in Kansas City, Mo. Sadly, from what I heard from those that were there Nick's original comment was true.

[Herby Wallace]

Jerry, I do agree with what you said and I am not offended at all, but I sometimes get carried away giving the other instruments solos which is my fault. When I am on stage, I actually lose all track of time. This year when I only played 4 songs on Friday, I was shocked because we had only done 3 songs and Stoney looked at me and said we only have time for one more which I wasn't expecting as I thought I would do at least two or three more as I had planned, so I will have to start paying closer attention to the time. Of course it depends on the MC and the crowd as I remember back in 1979, Scotty was doing MC work and I guess not watching the clock but I played last on Friday night and ended up playing over an hour as the crowd was wound up and didn't want to go to bed and back in those days there were not any side rooms with all night jams.

Herby Wallace

[Tony Prior]

Maybe one day, premier players such as Herby etc. may consider doing a different set format. Perhaps 3 or 4 longer solo songs where the arrangements are a couple of songs put together. Piano concerts do this all the time. There are plenty of concerts where the artist is solo. For example,Mandolin artist extraordinaire Chris Thiele tours the world performing solo or in a duo. Maybe we can encourage one of the stage pro's at the Steel shows to change formats and just not use a band, just play. Anyone up for stepping out of the box ?

t

PS, ok you don't want to play solo because of "meter" , have an acoustic guitar for rhythm. One thing is for certain, an artist that performs like this knows they have nowhere to hide, they will play !

[Jerry Overstreet]

I did not do a very good job of expressing my view, I guess. Personally, I would not want to ever do a solo set with tracks, BIAB or whatever unless there was no one around that could play.

Interacting with other musicians is half the fun of playing music.

I was speaking in general terms because I think sometimes performers feel obligated to pass it all around, and that can be tedious for listeners hungry for steel guitar at times.

What I was trying to state is that those great musicians are there because they love the steel guitar too, are unselfish, willing to sit through pieces and do back up work or whatever is necessary. Some are steel players as well, so they understand helping a player feel comfortable.

Some of my fondest memories of the ISGC are steel guitar greats interacting with other musicians.

Herby, in 2004, I recall your last set on Sun, I think, with Ben Brogdon and Roy Rosetta and the interaction between all of you is imprinted on my mind.

Speedy and Bobby, Jeff and Hoot, days of Pappy Wade Ray, Buddy Emmons and crew, etc.

One year, Bobby Regot and Jimmy Queen on twin drum kits. It may have been the set where Joe Wright and Sarah Jory teamed up for a smokin' set.

I expressed my appreciation for the band members mentioned, also Ric Boyer and David Russell, in this thread a few years back, lest anyone think my earlier comments were meant to be derogatory. They were not. http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... 2d25fefda7

Let me state further that but for the ISGC, I would probably never have known who some of my steel guitar heroes actually were. I remember walking into the Chase my first year...the first person I ran into was Herb Remington...there were all these great steel guitar players just walking around and sitting in the lounges and bars with the common people. Blew me away. Perhaps I have forgotten the tremendous education I gained through attendance of the International Steel Guitar Convention.

[Danny Hammers]

I tryed not to post but...

I wish everyone going to the convention could
Just go,
Have a good time,
Enjoy the music, and old friends,
Go home and say, “what good time I had”
Or don’t go back. 3 pages??


We in The Ole Derby Room had a great time this year.

Jam till 4:05AM with full band and 5 steel players
Lynn Owsley
Jim Vest
Joe Turner
Larry Moore
Ken Holycross

Patricia & I, had a lot of fun.

[Bill Lowe]

I'm with you Danny. I had a great time. met a few people and listened to great music. The main stage was good as well as the side rooms. I don't see how you could not have a good time. I still don't understand some of the builders. I would think a show like that would generate sales throughout the year, not just the weekend. Anyway it's not that hard. Look at the lineup of players......WOW

[Jack Stoner]

Danny, I've been going to the ISGC since 1978. And from 1978 to 1997 I went every year. As much as you would like to think it a side room such as the Derby Room is not THE ISGC.