How many of you pedal steel players enjoy playing non-pedal?

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 14 May 2011 12:46 pm

Mike, That catcan looks just like mine,only mine was a six string. Was GREAT on blues and rock and roll. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 14 May 2011 1:46 pm

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 15 May 2011 8:13 am

I don't know whether I'm a pedal steel guitarist who likes to play non-pedal or a non-pedal steel guitarist who like to play pedal.

Billy Wilson · Post by **Billy Wilson** » 15 May 2011 8:32 am

These days I'm playing the "Billy Robinson tuning" on a 10 string Alkire. I also do the G major Cajun tuning for those Cajun gigs.

Ruth Iseli-Dahler · Post by **Ruth Iseli-Dahler** » 15 May 2011 1:09 pm

I don't know whether I'm a pedal steel guitarist who likes to play non-pedal or a non-pedal steel guitarist who like to play pedal.

I completely agree, Alan.

My resos sounds quite different. But GREAT too.
I can play unplugged and travel by bike or train with a reso.....try this with a PSG

I love to check out different tunings on the reso
happy to learn them both

Mat Rhodes · Post by **Mat Rhodes** » 15 May 2011 5:43 pm

I packed up the pedal steel (of 17 years) in favor of non-pedal a little over a year ago. I could never get the tone required for the music I wanted to do (Hawaiian-flavored pop) and I got tired of the set-up and pack-up routine.

Now I find there are more fun challenges with NP than I thought possible due to the scarcity of harmonic real estate. The fat and weird voicings that I took for granted with C6th PSG are not so accessible now. And I have to be more precise about where I position the bar (slanted and non-slanted) for voicings that require behind-the-bar string pulls. And after all these years, I discovered I spent too much time trying to find and document all of those oddball voicings. The truth is that most of the listening audience (at least mine) don't care about "sophistication". I have a newfound respect for simplicity, or at least the illusion of it.

I enjoyed the PSG, but this is a new chapter and I don't plan on revisiting the prior ones. My only regret is that I didn't appreciate this sooner.

Thomas Ludwig · Post by **Thomas Ludwig** » 16 May 2011 1:22 am

I started with a lap steel. Now I have a PSG. Everytime I play at very small places where a I can't bring the PSG or a very short gig then I enjoy my lap steel.

Bill Mayville · Post by **Bill Mayville** » 16 May 2011 6:45 am

I have always thought that the reason for a lap steel,was intended for players that couldn't grasp the pedal steel.
I was wrong on that idea.now I am wondering how in the world, do they play all that with just two hands, and one bar.
OK.Serious question.please.No real, stupid answers.
Do they block the same way ?.Seems like we are always blocking, except while speed picking.
One More. Are there any laps steels, that are the leading brands?session players sometimes make remarks like,I wouldn't go to a session with out my,blank,blank.
I am thinking of it lately, because of my left foot.
At least it can't be too heavy.
I would love some serious answers,if possible.
Is there a 10 string//?
Blocker Bill

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 16 May 2011 7:23 am

Bill, you do have to rely your manipulation of the bar, whether in slanting or just moving it around quickly. I've tried as much as possible to get pedal steel sounds with my lap steel and I've transcribed and adapted many great tunes. I use the same kind of blocking (I think) that a pedal steel player would use--pick and palm and even bar--but i don't play with my right pinky extended like many pedal players do.

There are leading brands: Fender, Clinesmith, MSA, Rickenbacker, to name a few. I play Clinesmith and Fender, but I've owned almost one of everything at some point.

If you're interested in hearing some of the pedal sounds I can get, I compiled a few of them here in this thread: http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=200311

Greg Gefell · Post by **Greg Gefell** » 16 May 2011 12:43 pm

So if you are used to playing E9 only PSG (like I am) and you want to experiment with playing lap (or reso in my case) on gigs where the psg wont work for whatever reason, what 6 string tuning makes the most sense? When ever I try standard G on the reso I get lost quickly because of the different fret positions compared to E9.

Paul Crawford · Post by **Paul Crawford** » 17 May 2011 8:38 am

I started playing lap steel when I was picking up C6th pedals. I picked up Byrd's course to understand the approach and theory and found it directly related to the big neck. Now I use the PSG for gigging but break out of the lap steel for great old swing jams and some vintage music I play with some other groups.

I always keep my pet Deluxe 8 sitting by my chair and do a little noodling while watching the tube or listening to Willie's Place.

I still surprised every day with how much I don't know.

Roger Edgington · Post by **Roger Edgington** » 17 May 2011 9:32 am

My mother started me out on her old 6 string square neck box guitar when I was about 9. It was tuned to E and I learned on Hawaiian lessons she onece taught on. As I grew up I played on my Dads D6 Fender with E and C6th. Dad taught me a lot of the Byrd,Helms and others from the 50s. I finally got a pedal steel around 62 and pretty much quit playing NPS until about 6 years ago. I've been with a western swing band the last 17 years and have gotten back into NP. I like to play C 6th and if I wasn't so lazy I'd learn the Tom Morrell tuning.

I'm currently doing a 3 CD set with Billy Mata that is a tribute to Tommy Duncan,featured singer with Bob Wills. It's all non pedal. So far I've used a Fender T8 stringmaster,a single 10 my dad made in the 70s and a Parker S 10 I use for autographs. Also used my Zum without pedals.

Scott Henderson · Post by **Scott Henderson** » 17 May 2011 10:07 am

Love it....I play a whole bunch of tunings and guitars..I have a D-10 a UNI-12 and a double 8 NP...In fact currently working on a non pedal western swing CD...
My favs are Tom Morrell and Juaquinn Murphy....and of course Bobby Koeffer...

Rick Schacter · Post by **Rick Schacter** » 17 May 2011 6:34 pm

I prefer using a lap steel for rock and blues.
I have a 6 string Chandler that I tune to open E.
I use it with a BK Butler tube drive into a Fender Deluxe Reverb re-issue with a Shubb SP2 bar.

Lots of fun.

Rick

John Bechtel · Post by **John Bechtel** » 17 May 2011 7:52 pm

I've played both types for years! I started on a Single-6 Supro in ’48 and got my first ‘real’ PSG (Sho~Bud) in ’57. I still play both, although I haven't played out in several years. I've only gig’d with PSG since ’57. Couldn't find any non-pedal work after PSG became more popular! Now that I only play at home, most of my playing is done on both of my non-pedal guitars!

Frederic Mabrut · Post by **Frederic Mabrut** » 18 May 2011 12:13 am

Aside my Franklin I play a lot Don helms stuff on my Gibson D8 , I plays also Joaquin Murphy stuff on a S8 Hernnsdorf Lap steel and a bit of Dobro.

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 18 May 2011 12:16 pm

I too started on non-pedal but lost my first one long ago. I'd love to get into it again, I listen to a lot of old stuff nowadays, Western Swing etc., and it's a fascinating instrument.
But even if I had the money to buy a decent one (well I would want at least a D-eight), I doubt I could find the time for it if I want to play it well, unless I neglect PSG. Right now I'm too busy getting my chops on that one back together, in addition I got me a Dobro (well at least some kind of non-pedal guitar played with a bar), now that is also fun. Would love to play it more, but by the time I get around to practicing it's usually so late in the evening that I can't play acoustic instruments, only headphones (my neighbors go to bed early and the walls in the house are rather thin...)
Playing lap steel is still a project for the future.

JH

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 20 May 2011 6:58 am

I wonder how many who voted "no" play C6? I don't play pedal C6 so I'm not familiar with it, but are pedals utilized for soloing?

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 20 May 2011 7:11 am

I play a lot of c6 and use pedals for soloing.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 20 May 2011 11:13 am

The pedals on C6 do many of the "slant positions" on non-pedal C6. For example, pedal 6 lowers string 6 (E to D#)... an often used slant on C6 non-pedal to play a IV7 chord.

[tab]
non-pedal, C6 tuning

C7 (G, E, Bb, no root)

E------------
C-----7------ (G)
A-----7------ (E)
G------------
E-----6------ (Bb)
C------------

G C7
E------------------
C-----7-----7------
A-----------7------
G-----7------------
E-----7-----6------
C------------------

[/tab]

And pedal 5 lowers string 5 (G to F#)... an often used slant on C6 non-pedal to play a II9 chord.
[tab]
non-pedal, C6 tuning

A9 (B, G, C#, no root, no 5th)

E-----7------ (B)
C-----7------ (G)
A------------
G-----6------ (C#)
E------------
C------------

G A9
E-----7-----7------
C-----7-----7------
A------------------
G-----7-----6------
E------------------
C------------------

[/tab]

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 20 May 2011 1:30 pm

Doug, thanks. I figured that much, but what I wonder is if players use the pedals frequently to play single note solos, or if they use bar movement like non-pedal players do. To me, when I listen to Buddy Emmons, it sounds like he is using bar movement more, as opposed to pedals--on his C6 neck.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 20 May 2011 3:23 pm

There are a lot of "pedal licks" on C6, but I agree that most C6 players use slides and other bar movement to play single note stuff, scales, etc. A good example would be Buddy Emmons' C6 "pockets" (scale patterns).

Edward Meisse · Post by **Edward Meisse** » 25 Jul 2011 11:53 am

Ruth Iseli-Dahler wrote:I don't know whether I'm a pedal steel guitarist who likes to play non-pedal or a non-pedal steel guitarist who like to play pedal.

I completely agree, Alan.

My resos sounds quite different. But GREAT too.
I can play unplugged and travel by bike or train with a reso.....try this with a PSG
I love to check out different tunings on the reso
happy to learn them both

I have a trailer for my bicycle. I can carry a psg and a small amp.

Ruth Iseli-Dahler · Post by **Ruth Iseli-Dahler** » 25 Jul 2011 11:59 am

Bingo, Edward.

Photos?

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 25 Jul 2011 12:36 pm

I voted yes even though I do not have a Non pedal steel guitar yet. Ive played slide on various tunings over the years and probably 17 or 18 yrs. on the pedal steel E9 (Sho-Bud).
I'd like to learn C6 and or C13th eight string. I like B11th tuning also.

The Steel Guitar Forum

How many of you pedal steel players enjoy playing non-pedal?

How many of you pedal steel players enjoy playing non-pedal?

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