Are The Good Woods And Hot Steel Licks Vanishing?

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 14 Feb 2011 5:16 am

David,

You and my former woodworking instructor would have mingled famously in shop training. Thanks for your impressive listing of expensive woods. I'd be careful assuming that rare woods are bounteous throughout our forests, as they were once known to be. It simply isn't so. My favorite Latin term is: (URSUS ARCTOS HORRIBILIS). I like to translate it as a steel player with countless "HOT LICKS" who can literally eat you alive trading licks!

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 14 Feb 2011 5:39 am

Theresa,

The validity of your statement, reminds me of the
domino effect. There is plenty of life left in my steel. No signs of weakening as the seasons come and go. Thanks for your quippings, past and present. When it comes time to pack it in, (the steel), it will be a sorrowful moment. If I can't polish a lick on any given day, I'd say it's time for me to pack "it" away.

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 14 Feb 2011 3:36 pm

Bill Hankey wrote:Theresa,

The validity of your statement, reminds me of the
domino effect. There is plenty of life left in my steel. No signs of weakening as the seasons come and go.

Bill,

I'm surprised you disagree with her remark.....She actually rewrote your assumption......You say no hot licks are being played on recordings.....she said it was dead with a sarcastic flare.......Both assumptions are ridiculous.....That was the point of her quip.......Paul

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 15 Feb 2011 3:14 am

Paul,

Translating your comments and comparing them with "quips" that negates rationale from lesser players, helps to allow a better understanding of how a true professional is actually capable of making light of situations that do exist. Keeping things in check can be beneficial in most instances; you would of course, know how that goes. A consistent influx of "HOT LICKS", (not an occasional mind-boggling arrangement) that translates into too much effort for small rewards, is where I'm coming from. There are no limits to creating the most polished musical splendor. Just when a player may think he/she has taken the steel as far as it can go in a particular arrangement, an amazingly abrupt awakening, may alter one's thinking.. phenoms, or otherwise. It isn't possible to be an expert in defining all things.. not now, not ever.

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 15 Feb 2011 7:07 am

Bill,

....Your words show frustration...Instead of waiting for a recording to show you something hot and flashy to follow, why not innovate your thought process towards a more positive outlook at music in general....put your energy towards the study of how music works and apply that to a steel guitar in a way you can enjoy.......why focus on what others do for a living especially when you have no desire to pursue that type of employment?........Creating or advancing within music is an individual endeavor, not a group journey....Its certainly not broken into these fragmented sections you pose as questions....

The answer to your threads is always the same......Find a straight line towards something positive to study and master that and then move on to something new.....The next thing you know, your library will be full of useful musical ideas.

Gary Lee Gimble · Post by **Gary Lee Gimble** » 15 Feb 2011 8:17 am

something hot and flashy to follow

There are some who rely on just that for inspiration that may lead to innovation. For me, Joey Defrancesco, DJango and many more in that league provides an avenue on how said theory is applied. Well, Django's approach broke some rules but made it work....

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 15 Feb 2011 12:57 pm

Gary,

This business of searching for new hot licks encompasses the majority of practice sessions. After "discovering" a new "lick", the tendency is to go about polishing, and playing the notes over and over. I lost a lick that fit perfectly into "STORMS NEVER LAST". I'm hoping to find it recorded on a cassette tape that is stored away. I'm wondering if others have had the experience of losing a lick?

Archie Nicol · Post by **Archie Nicol** » 15 Feb 2011 4:56 pm

Yep. When they started making adhesive stamps.

I refuse to put my name to this.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 16 Feb 2011 5:00 am

Whoever first named catchy steel guitar patterns, "LICKS"? Oftentimes, I've weighed the possibilities of the "bright" individual who allowed the word to slip from his lips. What is preventing respectable players from making an issue of the unsophisticated expression? I'm surmising, that whomever first uttered the term, was definitely not of the sort to promote a good foundation for a very worthy occupation. I know, I'm very much aware of using the term as part of this thread's title. There is a possibility that a studious person cut short the "LICKING" word, which of course is defined as a sound thrashing by WEBSTER. Such a remote possibility is unlikely. After this thread closes, I propose to use the term properly, such as to lick a chocolate ice cream cone. As of now, I'm at a loss to assign a fitting term to describe a colossal breakthrough of scale patterns that are recognized as a credit to a specific individual. A large number of catchy changes in melodic blendings have roots in and around Tennessee, where early pioneers of scale patterns gathered in groups in garages, and old buildings, to share what they've learned. The large concentration of musically inclined in Tennessee, banded together and shared with each other much of what had been the shortest route to becoming an accomplished steel guitarist.

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 16 Feb 2011 6:44 am

Gary Lee Gimble wrote: There are some who rely on just that for inspiration that may lead to innovation.

Gary,

Listening for inspiration and transcribing great solos is certainly not a bad thing. In Jazz, I've used it as a means to discover the formulas the artist prefers for playing over or through certain types of changes and rhythms.....

The key words in your sentence are "may" and "innovation"......As a singular method for learning music, that's a big assumption........

To be clear about my original comment.....waiting for someone to play something hot and flashy and copying it verbatim is the precise formula for learning how to play music in another players innovative style...musicians do this with favorite musicians...or if they are hired for a gig that requires learning the parts from the record.......

Analyzing what is chosen by another player is a source for great examples of how theory is applied which is different from what I said....As a singular method of approaching music, copying generally does not lead to an innovated approach.....Creating ones own phrasings, melodic and rhythmic note choices, and harmonic sense is a direct path to originality......Pursuing original lines will eventually create a sound thats both innovative and unique from other like minded individuals.

I see the word "style" misused to describe great players who are actually interpreting another players style.....Some of what Django played was in the style of Louis Armstrong whose sound and style inspired Django.......Paul

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 16 Feb 2011 7:06 am

Hit submit twice

Joseph Barcus · Post by **Joseph Barcus** » 16 Feb 2011 7:07 am

Just when the chance comes by to play something nice (something hot and flashy) walks by and well there goes my something nice

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 16 Feb 2011 7:15 am

Bill Hankey wrote:Whoever first named catchy steel guitar patterns, "LICKS"?

......I've seen enough documentaries on early jazz where "Riff" and "Lick" were used to describe phrasings by Charlie Christian and Louis Armstrong.....

Paul

Gary Lee Gimble · Post by **Gary Lee Gimble** » 16 Feb 2011 8:00 am

key words in your sentence....

Paul,
Those operative words were partially intended to defend Mr Hankey but don't ask to pinpoint or paraphrase what he wrote as some of his comments have already been deleted or edited. Or, his train of thought, or his expressions, got lost in the translation

Back to the day gig now...my resources are being tapped out....key of Db
gL

Joseph Barcus · Post by **Joseph Barcus** » 16 Feb 2011 12:58 pm

ok I am going to chime in here one more time. well lots of things involved here lets think about the older players you know the ones with all the jobs, these guys worked very hard to be where they are look at how young Buddy Emmons was, or Jimmy Day. they were very very young and while most kids were outside playing ball they had a sandwish in one hand and working on the steel in between bites. "hot Licks" what are they. well that could be that nice run,lick,phrase in Apartment #9. now today you will here some stock intro that fits several songs and you dont know what the song is until you hear "just follow" lets see we have covered the profession of the player, what about their attitute towards others now that is a big issue for sure for you can be the very best player around the world but if you cant get along with people then you will not be working.and thats a fact. are you or would you be the type of player that plays only when your needed or are you going to hang a flashing light over head that says look at me Im the steel player and play or try to play everything you know in your 30 seconds of fame. or are you going to KISS (keep It Simple Stupid) kind of guy guess whos getting all the work again makes no difference how many (HOT LICKS) you know. I think one should learn your scales and know when and when not to play, know when to stay on your side of the stage and not be in the middle trying to cover up the artist. In a recording studio you dont always get to play what you want to play its what the man wants thats signing your check.Piece Out

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 16 Feb 2011 1:28 pm

If pickers like the Big E,Charlton,Franklin, White,are ok with [HOT LICKS] that's fine with me,let Bill use the term anyway he likes,could'nt care less. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 16 Feb 2011 2:00 pm

Edited to omit unnecessary commentary. $:\$

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 16 Feb 2011 2:57 pm

Edited to omit commentary on Bill's preceding edit of his "unnecessary commentary"…..

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 17 Feb 2011 1:16 pm

One thing that must be avoided, if one is to survive amongst accursed verbiage in the aftermath of dribblings away from the thread's intended purpose, is neglecting to focus on pertinacity. The persistence of great players like Emmons, Newman, White, and others too numerous to mention, should be more than enough counter influences to cue an assemblage of forum writers to the task of keeping with a thread's intended purpose. Drifting away from the satisfactory terminology used to describe a musical series of catchy notes, and the scarcities of special wood grains, must be recognized as such.

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 17 Feb 2011 7:28 pm

That should explain everything, I guess.

YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.

John Robel · Post by **John Robel** » 17 Feb 2011 9:01 pm

stercus tauri

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 18 Feb 2011 5:07 am

Deleted opposing commentary

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 18 Feb 2011 5:11 am

Barry Blackwood wrote:Edited to omit commentary on Bill's preceding edit of his "unnecessary commentary"…..

Barry - you cracked me up with that and made my morning.

Ken Metcalf · Post by **Ken Metcalf** » 18 Feb 2011 6:39 am

Plenty of licks in my neck of the woods.
Come to Dallas or bring up the kvet radio station in Austin.

kevin ryan · Post by **kevin ryan** » 18 Feb 2011 7:22 am

What an interesting thread. I love the concept of" discovering formulas" .. That's exactly what it is. I use it constantly to increase my fretboard vocabulary. I like learning phrases in small note clusters and then tying them together with my own style. I will hear something on youtube by Paul Franklin, Mike Smith, Mike Johnson or whomever...just 4 or 5 notes they played out of a long solo that sounds curious to me and maybe something that I would like to understand more...here's the cool tip...I download the video and I load it into riffmaster, find the notes, see how it relates to the underlying chords, slow it down and commit it to memory.. That weekend I make a conscience effort to incorporate those into my playing...It's great fun and rewarding, keeps me coming back...