Shobud Fingertips and Permanents----got a picture??

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 25 Dec 2010 4:16 pm

That's a Permanent.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 25 Dec 2010 4:48 pm

Notice this picture is one side cleaned up, the other still dirty. But it displays where the spring rides. See the yellow arrow.

There is no way a spring will get between the stop and the fingertuner, unless the spring is bent and distorted. See the yellow circle around a couple with the springs on.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 30 Dec 2010 8:49 am

A cool tone example with Johnny Paycheck and Hal Rug----enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUhhDrSR ... re=related

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 30 Dec 2010 9:33 am

Excellent pics and description of the system James! And a distinct improvement over the system on my earlier Fingertip. These adjusters, and the newer style bell cranks, show that they were thinkin' and improvin' all the time back then.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 10 Jan 2011 8:32 pm

Yepper, John!

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 15 Jan 2011 10:33 pm

Bob Muller · Post by **Bob Muller** » 10 Apr 2011 11:14 am

Here are some photos of the D 12 fingertip that I just got. I believe this is a later model fingertip because of some of the changes in construction over the D 10 that I have. This guitar has Schaller tuners, adjustable tension on the changer Springs, newer style connectors on the pedal rods, the bottom is painted black, and it has what appears to be four original style knee levers. It is in need of some restoration, I'm not quite sure how far it will go with this one.

Also notice that the rollers on the nut are quite a bit larger than the string ball ends on the earlier models. The hex screws on the end plate are used to adjust the spring tension on the changer fingers. These are some of the changes it makes it appear to be a later model of the fingertip.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 10 Apr 2011 11:56 am

Nice guitar! I think it may have had some upgrades. Note that the changer has the acorn nuts on the end of the adjusters. That's like my '63, and unlike James Morehead's latter guitar. Butt, you have the "bubble butt" bell cranks. They have that "dome-shape" on the back side. Mine are just flat. Yours will have smoother action. You also seem to have a mix of pedals. And the rod ends might have been changed, as the older style are kinda clunky. You have decent rollers. Mine has the string ball end rollers. The Schaller tuners are the same style that came on my sorta "Proto-Pro" '67 S-10. And you have the adjustable springs. Very nice!

Bob Muller · Post by **Bob Muller** » 10 Apr 2011 12:22 pm

John at first I thought the guitar may have been modified, but after looking at it I think it was built that way. It's very similar in concept to the one that just sold yesterday if you look at the way that guitar was built it's much like this one, and I believe they were both late-model guitars. Searle number on this guitar is 9 341 341, the one sold yesterday was8-390 390. I'm beginning to think more and more that the serial numbers do have something to do with how many guitars are built, the three numbers 341 and 390 would make sense in that respect. I wondered if the first number could somehow indicate the year, but in this case that would not seem to follow in order. It would be nice if someone could collect serial numbers on a few hundred guitars, then maybe we could see some sort of pattern. The tag on the front of this guitar says Madison Tennessee, I'm pretty sure though someone changed that. It would had to of been someone who had a stock of old decal tags available!

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 10 Apr 2011 12:29 pm

Well, they were never ones to throw out any parts! And I think I've read that F-Tips were basically custom built guitars. You said what you wanted, and plunked down the cash. My serial number is 7 207 207.
Maybe Bobbe will chime back in. He would know, cuz I think he was there then.

Edited to add; Yup! It sure does look like the one Rick sold. Mismatched pedals on that guitar too. Notice where the notched 3rd pedal ended up. Still gotta be older than Morehead's though. His changer is different. Go back in this thread and check his out.

Bob Muller · Post by **Bob Muller** » 10 Apr 2011 1:43 pm

John again this is a guess on my part but I think some of the parts on the D-12 appear to be the older style because they only made a very few 12 string guitars. I doubt if they would have changed some of the parts as they did on the 10 stringed models. Look at the key head, it looks like the early style 10 stringed models, but it has the newer style Schaller tuners. They probably would not have changed the housing around the changer for the 12 string model either. The key head does however have newer style larger rollers installed in it. I think the first 4 foot pedals may have been modified or changed, the appear to be shinier than the rest. I'm not sure if they were shaved down, or actually replaced with newer ones. The rest appear to be original.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 10 Apr 2011 2:05 pm

I think you're on the money there Bob. Certainly is the older style keyhead, with better rollers. Maybe just a matter of taking the old ball end keyhead, and doing a little more machining to add the more modern rollers.

Mark Durante · Post by **Mark Durante** » 11 Apr 2011 4:01 am

Mine is 7-227-227
You gotta think 7 is the year and 227 is the number but of course, maybe other factors were involved

Bob Muller · Post by **Bob Muller** » 11 Apr 2011 5:20 pm

MARK, I was thinking along those same lines where the first number would be the year it was built, or maybe sold, and the other 3 numbers would be the number of the guitar. If we could get some more people to post numbers some sort of pattern may show up.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 26 May 2011 1:44 pm

Any new ideas on the srial number system?

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 26 May 2011 2:09 pm

James,
The F-Tip serial numbers are a mystery to me. They are so different than regular ShoBud numbers. A single digit first, followed by a pair of matching three digit numbers. Bobbe Seymore may know.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 26 May 2011 2:20 pm

I said, in an earlier post;

" My serial number is 7 207 207"

I think that my serial number destroys our conjectures that the first number indicates the year. My guitar is the most "primitive" on this thread. Ricky told me it was definitely a "first run" guitar. There's no way it's a '67 guitar!

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 26 May 2011 5:53 pm

John, mine is 7 206 206. Some one emailed pics of their guitar to me today--looks just identical to mine, and it's seial is 7 211 211. I figure mine to be first year run, too. That would be '63 according to Duane Becker's website.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 26 May 2011 5:59 pm

BobbeSeymour wrote:Jim, to answer your question (and compliment you on your wonderful endevour to build parts for these guitars), the numbering system had more to do with bookwork than it did with model changes, it really had nothing to do with years or what changes were made to the guitars.

I'll re-check with David but last time we talked he was a little busy and we were interupted often. But it did line up with what info I had retained in my years hang around at the factory after my MSA time.

A lot of double numbering was the practice at the time.

I sold Lloyds D-10 finger tip guitar to a great guy in Bandera Texas in 1996, Gary Boyd is his name. He won't sell it for any amout.

These guitars really aren't from Sho-Buds greatest hour but I love them for their beauty and impossible to obtain woods.

The perminant models are by far my favorites, problem proof fingers with incredible wood in most. This is what I get to play on every job in Nashville I can get by with it on.

I treasure these great guitars that started the Sho-Bud legend. Far from perfect, however these are the basis of all the brands of steel guitar built today. I wish these guitars were being built today,,,True golden age steel guitars.

What great info, Bobbe, again, thankyou. Is David still busy--did ya ask him yet? purdy-pleaze??

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 26 May 2011 6:04 pm

James Morehead wrote:

John, this is the guitar that serials in at 7 206 206.

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 28 May 2011 1:24 pm

I could drool over those pictures forever, some of the most beautiful guitars ever built. This is not 100 per cent on the topic, but... I notice that not all but many of those Fingertips have 9 pedals. Can anyone tell me what the 9th pedal usually does?

Mark Durante · Post by **Mark Durante** » 29 May 2011 3:04 pm

So if that first number is not the year, is the second duplicate set of numbers sequential?
Mine has early features except for the Nashville logo. (I can still see the shadow of what I believe is the original Nashville logo although at some time in the past it was removed and a amp logo screwed on in it's place).

Bob Muller · Post by **Bob Muller** » 30 May 2011 9:31 am

Here are some photos of the S 10 fingertip that I just got. This also appears to be a later production guitar which has the adjustable return springs, and newer style tuners. It has a custom-made brass tag in place of the show Bud logo. The serial number is interesting on this guitar as it doesn't seem to follow the pattern of the other fingertips shown above. Serial number is 8020 stamped into the end plate. I've not seen any other S 10 Fingertip serial numbers so not sure why the number series is different from the D 10. http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/userpix1 ... 0084_1.jpg[/img]

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 30 May 2011 9:55 am

I think I read on the serial number thread, that Shobud had reserved the 8,000 series numbers, when Baldwin came onboard. So I think this beauty has gotta be from around '67/'68.

The Steel Guitar Forum

Shobud Fingertips and Permanents----got a picture??

No Acorn nuts in this pic

D-12 fingertip

S-10 Fingertip