Tweed Amps with PSG?

Chris Harvey · Post by **Chris Harvey** » 7 Dec 2010 8:59 am

I was thinking about checking into a tweed bassman or the like. I'm VERY happy with my vibrosonic and session 400 but thought it may be fun to have one around. I spoke with Victoria Amps and they have a 80 Watt Bassman they could load with a 15. I just picked up a fingertip and thought it may pair well with it ( i love that sixties sound).

I'll always lean towards my session as it rings out every mistake I make perfectly! Just wondering if anyone out there in steel guitar land uses them other than non pedal guys.

John Groover McDuffie · Post by **John Groover McDuffie** » 7 Dec 2010 11:39 am

Check out Ken Fox's tweed-style amps. Me makes one specially for PSG with a 15" or 2x12. He also has a Bassman style. Probably less $$ than a Victoria, and I bet the quality is just as good. Plus he's a Fo-Bro.

http://www.foxvintageamps.com/

OK Ken, what is my commission?

Roger Crawford · Post by **Roger Crawford** » 7 Dec 2010 12:26 pm

My guess would be that Ken's quality is better.

Ken Metcalf · Post by **Ken Metcalf** » 7 Dec 2010 1:50 pm

Roger Crawford wrote:My guess would be that Ken's quality is better.

My Guess also

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 7 Dec 2010 2:10 pm

Roger Crawford wrote:My guess would be that Ken's quality is better.

For what reason?

Chris Lucker · Post by **Chris Lucker** » 7 Dec 2010 3:03 pm

Roger Crawford wrote:My guess would be that Ken's quality is better.

Better than that of my 1950 V=Front Super? Remember, "sum of its parts." Quality may not always translate into tone. Joaquin Murphey made one of these V-Fronts sound good.

Not the best picture, I guess.

John Groover McDuffie · Post by **John Groover McDuffie** » 7 Dec 2010 3:39 pm

Roger Crawford wrote:My guess would be that Ken's quality is better.

Chris, I think Roger was referring to ken Fox's amps vs. Victoria amps, and he admittedly was making a guess. I doubt he meant to comment on the quality of the original tweeds!

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 7 Dec 2010 4:07 pm

Did someone say Fender tweed?...

but then, go back to the 30's for a Gibson 185..

Roger Crawford · Post by **Roger Crawford** » 7 Dec 2010 7:12 pm

My comment was indeed directed toward the Victoria. I've had the honor of knowing Ken for several years, and have had the opportunity to visit his shop on several ocassions. Ken's knowledge and work ethics are beyond reproach. If he builds it, it's built right. Hand selected components, hand wired with precission. And, the sum of his parts DO equal tone.

Frank Parish · Post by **Frank Parish** » 7 Dec 2010 7:18 pm

It ain't a Fender but that little NV-112 makes a nice Tweed amp!

Ken Fox · Post by **Ken Fox** » 7 Dec 2010 7:57 pm

The Victoria amps use the same metal chassis I use, same fiber boards and hand style wiring. Gregg Hopkins builds their cabinets. My cabinets are top of the line by Mojotone (who is now building Fender cabs, I have been told). They make a very nice amp but I disagree with the use of Orange Drop caps in Tweed era amps. They build the same 212 Tweed High Powered Twin for around $3350.00 that I sell for $2039.00 in brown Tolex. We also do the same amp with a 15" for $1999.00. Our prices also include a D2F cover.

Both of our amps offer a bias adjustment not found in the original amps. I also have separate fusing for the 5 VAC and 6.3 VAC supplies as well as an in-rush current limiter on the 120 VAC side.

I also have a plug-in solid state rectifier for additional B+ that gets us around 92 watts out of the amp. The socket will accept the original 5AR4/GZ34 for a total of 80 watts.

I am not aware of an 80 watt Bassman amp! The high powered tweed Twin was in fact the 80 watt version of the 1959 Bassman (same amp, two more power tubes and larger transformers to handle the extra power).

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 8 Dec 2010 12:17 am

Roger Crawford wrote:My comment was indeed directed toward the Victoria. I've had the honor of knowing Ken for several years, and have had the opportunity to visit his shop on several ocassions. Ken's knowledge and work ethics are beyond reproach. If he builds it, it's built right. Hand selected components, hand wired with precission. And, the sum of his parts DO equal tone.

I'm confident Ken makes great stuff too. But we shouldn't give the diss to reputable manufacturers without any actual experience.

Dave Grafe · Post by **Dave Grafe** » 8 Dec 2010 3:16 pm

To answer the original question, I used a 4-10" Bassman with a Fender reverb tank for many years, a fabulous amp with a 15" JBL in it...

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 8 Dec 2010 9:12 pm

Ken's my bud and without ever playing one I *know* his amps are top-quality...and as he noted, his prices are lower than Victoria.

However - Victoria is well-known for their high-quality, no-compromise construction methods. The difference is (other than price) is that Victoria's goal initially (and today, although they have branched out slightly by making some "fun" nonexistent "Fender" amps)) was to make clones of the original Fender amps - and using commonly-available parts (just as Leo did - and many of the early suppliers are gone or no longer make same-spec parts). They use the same parts values but from current manufacturers - just straightforward Fender clones. Like Ken I'm not a huge fan of orange drops (depending on *which* ones are used, as there are multiple types) but I respect Mark Baier's goal of making "tweeds" available to today's players at reasonable prices.

And before someone jumps on $3k as NOT being a "reasonable price", try doing a currency conversion between 1950's dollars and today's dollars - a popular subject on boutique amp forums. The original 1957 Fender Twin sold for $339.00. That's $2640 in 2010 dollars - and that's using just a flat inflation calculator, not factoring differences in legal compliance (changes that HAVE to be made for legal reasons) nor shipping costs - nor the costs of advertising. That's just item-only dollar-for-dollar.

Take it in reverse - a Peavey Nashville 112 at a street price of 589.99 would have been a $75.80 amp in 1957. Those who know my amp preferences will understand my lack of any related followup comment.

So - I felt it fair to point out that dissing an amplifier one has never played is not warranted, and also thought I'd have a little fun with the thoughts about prices (I hear few steelers complain about the price of hand-built steels but flip out when they see hand-wired amp prices - sometimes a little perspective doesn't hurt.).

Ken - anybody have one of yours in the LA area???

Roger Crawford · Post by **Roger Crawford** » 9 Dec 2010 5:43 am

My comments are not necessarily a diss to Victoria, but a glowing endosement of Ken's product. Some are assuming I have never played a Victoria. I have in fact had the use of our guitar players 50212 to test. Yes, it's a quality product. For my taste, it didn't seem to have the lows I like, and maybe due to my preference for 15" speakers. It also tended to break up too early. Maybe the 80212 would have been better in that regard. I have test driven Ken's amp, and with 90 watts and a 15" speaker, it was amazing. I'm saving my spare change to get one.

Ken Fox · Post by **Ken Fox** » 9 Dec 2010 6:03 am

We have sold a 4x10 clone of the 1954 Bassman (30 watt amp) and a reverb unit to Rich Hlaves, in Corona.

We have sold a lot of the steel amps but none in California,

We have them in:

Texas
Oregon
Nevada
Tennessee
Florida
Virginia
South Carolina
Mass.
Ohio
New York

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 10 Dec 2010 4:13 am

For a classic sound, I'd love to buy this amp. A '62 Pro, with a 15. Solid state rectifier
http://www.guitarseminars.com/gs/viewtopic.php?t=5762

Joe A. Camacho · Post by **Joe A. Camacho** » 10 Dec 2010 2:06 pm

I've got a Victoria 35115 that I love playing through.

Chris Gilchrist · Post by **Chris Gilchrist** » 15 Dec 2010 2:19 pm

One comment on Victorias (I think this is true - I haven't looked inside one to verify)- even though those look like standard orange drop caps (e.g. 716P's), I think they're not. According to their website, those are custom made caps that are not polypropylene film.
http://www.victoriaamp.com/whats_inside.html

That said, Ken's amp looks perfect for pedal steel.

Rich Hlaves · Post by **Rich Hlaves** » 15 Dec 2010 3:04 pm

I can't say enough good about my Fox 4-10 amp. It is as near perfect an amp for steel, lap or six string I have ever played. If you like moderate power and clean headroom this is a wonderful amp to own. I wrote a review of the amp when I first received it and posted it on the SGF. Ken has put it up on his website in the 5D6B testimonial section. Mine is the second writing in that section. It ended up unsigned on the website.

Everything I wrote that first day of ownership is still true today. I find the amp is even more versitile now than I thought it was then. I hope to own one of Ken's Twin amps when funds allow.

I am perfectly capable of building my own amps and have done so on a few occasions (design build and clones). I'm hear to tell you I could not build the 5D6B Fox Bassman for much less, maybe $200 less, than Ken sells it for. That does not include the shipping of all the parts from mutiple vendors. There is over $400 worth of speakers in that amp, $300+ or so in the cabinet. Add up the iron, chassis, pots and small parts, Ken makes very little on these amps. I don't think this is an expensive amplifier at all. Look what Fender sells their tweed reissues for. $2K for a Deluxe! Yikes! No where near the build and component quality of the Fox product or the Victoria for that matter.

Although I have played through, tested and repaired a Victoria or two over the years. I have never owned one. Nice amps, good tone, quality build. Fender tweed sound. Premium upscale price although not unfair.

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 16 Dec 2010 5:53 pm

I've got a late 50's fender pro that sound killer for pedal and lap steel. But I think I would prefer one of Ken's amps.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 16 Dec 2010 7:44 pm

Dan Tyack wrote:I've got a late 50's fender pro that sound killer for pedal and lap steel. But I think I would prefer one of Ken's amps.

Yup. It's hard to beat a vintage Fender, but what Ken does IS the way to beat a vintage Fender. Classic design, proven tone and circuits, very high quality parts, excellent build quality and attention to detail, basically the real deal only new and better.

Brad