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Topic: Adjustment to 2-position RKR lever? (GFI Expo) |
Paul Green
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 7:02 am |
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O wise ones. I am trying to make my RKR lever more responsive to lighter knee pressure, and still maintain the feel of a transition point between the two lever positions. Any suggestions/technical info would be appreciated.
I have a GFI Expo S-10 w/pad, about one year old. Recently I've been learning more ways to use the 2-position RKR lever, but I'm finding the original factory setting very stiff. I have to really slam my knee over and jam it in there good in order to hold the lever in tune to the second position. I found the spring adjustment screws there below the changers, and backed off the screws for the 2nd and 9th strings, but this did not reduce the lever tension very much.
Has anyone dealt with this issue? Are these spring adjustment screws the only possible adjustment I can try? Is this something I have to have professional service for? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Paul in NC |
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Robert Murphy
From:
West Virginia
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 1:34 pm
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| The way I understand the physics of the knee lever is you must trade distance for resistance. The long travel of the lever is there to move the string a whole tone. GFI has a rod chart that will tell you exactly where the rods go and into which holes. Make sure you guitar is set up correctly. I solved the problem by purchasing longer legs and a low volume pedal so that my knee was near the end of the lever for more distance vs. resistance. Greater mechanical advantage if you will. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 4:37 pm
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| Quote: |
| Has anyone dealt with this issue? Are these spring adjustment screws the only possible adjustment I can try? |
Those springs are not for adjusting the amount of pressure (or stiffness) it takes to move a lever or pedal. Be careful loosening (or even tightening) these springs. You may end up with strings that don't come back to the proper pitch after you lower the strings.
From the Carter resources page, about return springs:
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Return springs are necessary to make sure that the lowering fingers of the changer return to rest against the return stop after you have lowered a string. They also keep the lowering finger against the return stop when raising a string. Because the fingers are always referenced to a FIXED stop, tuning problems such as drift and repeatability should be typically non-existent. |
That is the purpose of the springs, not for adjusting pedals or knee levers.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 55 years and still counting. |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 6:23 pm Re: Adjustment to 2-position RKR lever? (GFI Expo)
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| Paul Green wrote: |
I am trying to make my RKR lever more responsive to lighter knee pressure, and still maintain the feel of a transition point between the two lever positions.
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As you suspect, these 2 goals are in opposition to each other. The additional resistance/tension caused by the spring on string 9 is what allows you to feel the halfway point.
| Paul Green wrote: |
I found the spring adjustment screws there below the changers, and backed off the screws for the 2nd and 9th strings, but this did not reduce the lever tension very much.
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Just make sure they are tight enough to return the string to pitch. There is not much else to do, unless you want to install longer springs (as I did.)
| Paul Green wrote: |
Are these spring adjustment screws the only possible adjustment I can try? |
Some guitars have another spring mounted on a bracket under the guitar, to provide a more definite feel for the half stop. Look around for that on your guitar |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 10:58 pm
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| The key to a good feel stop is the disparity in tension between the 2nd string and the 9th string lowers. If you have no raise on the 2nd string it is easier to adjust it for very light tension- just enough to let it return properly. If you also raise the 2nd string you need not only enough tension to allow if to return but also to stay put when raising it and sometimes that requires more. Then you simply play with the tension on the 9th string adjusting it to allow you to feel it w/o moving the guitar sideways. This assumes that the two strings are set to give a decent 1/2 stop to begin with which I expect they are as the great folks at GFI know what they are doing. |
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Tony Glassman
From:
The Great Northwest
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Posted 1 Dec 2010 11:34 pm
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I agree with Jim re: the 9th string return spring.
The primary function of that spring is to return the lowered 9th string C# back to D and in most cases is adjusted with just enough tension to bring the open note back to pitch.
In the case of the second string half- stop, the 9th string return spring has the secondary function of providing the resistance we feel as the "detente" at D. So when dialing in a 2nd sting half stop, you tighten the 9th string return spring so you can feel the half stop. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 2 Dec 2010 12:38 am
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| Quote: |
| In the case of the second string half- stop, the 9th string return spring has the secondary function of providing the resistance we feel as the "detente" at D. So when dialing in a 2nd sting half stop, you tighten the 9th string return spring so you can feel the half stop. |
Interesting. I didn't know that, but then I don't lower my 9th string on my Carter. It has a separate "half" finger in the 11th string position (or where an 11th string would be if I had a 12 string guitar) for half stops.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, Recording King Professional Dobro, NV400, NV112,Ibanez Gio guitar, Epiphone SG Special (open D slide guitar) . Playing for 55 years and still counting. |
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Paul Green
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 2 Dec 2010 6:40 am Thanks
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Thank you, all, for your most excellent help! I have done some further tinkering, and for now, I am going to try a set up with no half-step on the RKR lever, just a single short move that drops strings 2 and 9 by a half step. That means I no longer have a whole-step drop on string 2, but at my present level of ability, simplification seems like a good idea -- frankly, I don't have a flipping clue what to do with the whole-step drop on string 2 anyway. Am I missing something obvious? (Wouldn't be the first time)
Thanks again -- all of these replies were really, really helpful.
--Paul |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 2 Dec 2010 6:58 am
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| The Carter guitars utilize a separate finger for the half stops as their return springs are not adjustable so one utilizes the bellcrank and half-stop finger rod placement for the feel. The springs on a Carter can be cut or stretched to change the tension if necessary. |
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