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Topic: Steel guitars and TV |
Albert Svenddal
From:
Minneapolis, MN
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 12:07 pm |
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I have just finished watching the Home Coming of the Grand Old Opry live (taped) since the big flood and have one basic question. Why is it the steel players (if there is one), is always pushed off to the far end of the platform and there are very few, if any, camera shots? Are we any less part of the band than the drummers or guitar players (who always gets several shot)? What can be done to get a little more attention to the ones who help make the music?
Just thinking out loud.
Any comments?
Albert
_________________
Williams D-12 9x7, Emmons PP D-10, 8X5, Quilter SteeAire amp. |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 12:16 pm
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I think they hate us Albert  I was just watching a PBS airing of an earlier Hardly, Strictly etc. event and they did the same thing there. Never flinching when the singer or banjo was on. Soon as the steel ride began, they choose to show the parking lot or some kids dancing and only a few seconds of the steel ride.
One spot had Marty Muse playing his a$$ of, but they only showed a stingy portion of it. |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 1:09 pm
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| The other players need the attention to get their nut while the steelers are happy enough just playing the steel guitar and not some other boring thing.... |
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Brett Day
From:
Pickens, SC
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 2:08 pm
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I think I saw a close-up of Kevin Post and his ShowPro with Blake Shelton and Wayne Dahl and his Zumsteel with Martina.
Brett |
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Ray Minich
From:
Bradford, Pa. Frozen Tundra
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 2:32 pm
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Been that way for the 50+ years I've been watchin' TV.
Just one of those things...
_________________
Lawyers are done: Emmons SD-10, 3 Dekleys including a D10, NV400, and lots of effects units to cover my clams... |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 3:16 pm
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| Once steel guitars start leading the stinking bands again then the spotlight will follow. |
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Billy Tonnesen
From:
R.I.P., Buena Park, California
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 3:48 pm
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| Back in the days of early Western Swing the Steel Player was usually in the Front Row of the Band. If a Band had a really good Steel player the Bandleader was proud of them and they were highlighted in the arrangements and given solos. Also Steel Players in the Bands were very well liked by the Public. |
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Sonny Priddy
From:
Elizabethtown, Kentucky, USA, R.I.P.
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 5:16 pm Opry
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| What Opry? To Me There Is No Grand ole Opry Anymore It's Gone. SONNY. |
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C Dixon
From:
Duluth, GA USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 6:01 pm
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| Ray Minich wrote: |
Been that way for the 50+ years I've been watchin' TV.
Just one of those things... |
Without doubt. And it is NO coincidence in all too many incidents. I have seen it so much that you can almost anticipate it. They rarely EVER have a problem finding the guitar player, the singer, the banjo player, the dobro player, the pianist, or whatever, but more times than not, they are either late, almost totally late, OR all you get is the sound.
AND I have even seen it on GOO shows on UTube, countless times. And that is unforgivable. Sometimes I might forgive a TD, who may not be that familiar with a PSG. But NOT the GOO. PSG cut its eye teeth AT the GOO for sure!
It is a shame, a sham, and ridiculous and offensive. I have studied this in depth and thought about it many times. And I tell you I do believe I know the reason for it.
It is very subtle to downright deliberate, but I believe MOST of it is due to downright jealousy of THE world's most beautiful instrument. Why did of all people, Chet Atkins rarely EVER have a PSG player on any of his shows. Same for Floyd cramer who STOLE a basic PSG lick
And one other pet peave, why is it that many great groups have NO steel player at all. They have that infernal framing bass and drums AND 1, 2, 3 or even 4 guitars plankin away. And of course more often than not a piano player. But how many have NO sign of a steel. Why?
And don't say, "The steel just doesn't fit this kind of music". Since when?
Bah humbug!
c.
_________________
A broken heart + † = a new heart. |
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Ryan Barwin
From:
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 6:32 pm
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I guess we have to admit, for most viewers, steel players just aren't that exciting to watch, compared to the rest of the band. We sit behind a table, look down, and do our thing.
Personally, I'm happy watching that all night, but it's probably boring to most people, even if the sound it produces isn't...
As for those Western Swing bands, that frequently non-pedal, where the steel player could stand up, and fit in with the rest of the band.
That being said, steel players should definitely be featured more on TV. Can't stand when I'm watching a band play on TV, and there's a steel solo, or a really nice steel part, and they show the singer or guitar player...
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www.pedalsteel.ca |
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Charles Davidson
From:
Phenix City Alabama, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 6:56 pm
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That's just common,Very seldom watch the [Not so grand ole opry] But remember watching awhile back and Tommy was playing a GREAT solo,What was the shot on TV ? A kid in the crowd picking his nose. Go figure.   YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.
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Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC ! |
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Ray Riley
From:
Des Moines, Iowa, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 7:17 pm Marty Stuart
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| I just by chance watched Rfd's Marty Stuart's show. He introduced all his band and Gary Carter was on steel. When it came time to feature him on break,they had him so low in the mix I could not even hear him, and he was backing up Connie Smith. It looked like he was doing a good job but only the sound man knows for sure. Ray |
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Charles Davidson
From:
Phenix City Alabama, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 7:31 pm
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Ray,I have heard several say that about the steel on Martys show. Maybe it could be the network you are on.[  ] I get RFD on my local cable and can always hear the steel loud and clear,and he gets featured a lot on that show .GREAT show  YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.
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Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC ! |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 7:47 pm
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| C Dixon wrote: |
I believe MOST of it is due to downright jealousy of THE world's most beautiful instrument.
Chet Atkins rarely EVER have a PSG player on any of his shows. Same for Floyd cramer who STOLE a basic PSG lick. |
I've long thot that to be true too often. There really is little other explanation.
And as you know well, Carl, Chet's best friend was Jerry Byrd, who told Jerry in the 60s "I'd really like to use you, Jerry, but the producers don't want it". I always felt Chet should have done better than that, after all, he was Mr. Nashville... |
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Leslie Ehrlich
From:
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 8:43 pm
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Is it the steeler's fault or the show producer's fault? If the steeler thinks he's just a sideman he'll set up in the corner.
How many members in the band? Is there room for a steeler at the front of the stage?
Does the steeler play important parts to songs or just add a little embellishment or a 'country' feeling to the music? If the steel part is not important, the steeler won't get much attention.
Does the cameraman know what a steel guitar is and does he know when to point it at the steeler when the steeler plays a solo?
_________________
Sho-Bud Pro III + Marshall JMP 2204 half stack = good grind! |
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Charles Davidson
From:
Phenix City Alabama, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2010 9:16 pm
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At least one gets front and center,right in your face. RR. YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.
_________________
Hard headed, opinionated old geezer. BAMA CHARLIE. GOD BLESS AMERICA. ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST. SUPPORT LIVE MUSIC ! |
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Ray McCarthy
From:
New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 2:28 am
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As far as why more bands don't have steel, I think the scarcity of steel players compared to guitar players (a dime a dozen)has a lot to do with it. Even if a band found a steel player who played the way they like, replacing him, should he leave for any reason (so many of us are older, after all) would be difficult. So they just don't figure a steel in to begin with.
Derby, TruTone, NV112, Holy Grail |
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David Nugent
From:
Gum Spring, Va.
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 3:59 am
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| Years ago, I frequently recorded the Grand Ole Opry and would save certain performances that were IMO memorable(Vince Gill singing "When I Call Your Name" with Roy Acuff standing by in the background comes to mind.) It seems that at that time, the camera crew was much more attentive to which instrument was playing and when and usually were focused on those players at the appropriate times. I have not watched the Opry Live show in quite some time, but the last time I did watch it almost appeared as if the camera people were instructed to purposely avoid focusing on the steel guitar. I often wonder if this is because Nashville, in its obvious efforts to distance itself from traditional Country music, views the instrument as the one remaining link to the past? |
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Barry Blackwood
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 6:26 am
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| "Where's the steel player?" has been a running gag for years at my house. Just gotta shrug it off and move on, 'cause it ain't gonna change anytime soon .... |
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Barry Blackwood
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 6:36 am
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| Quote: |
| Same for Floyd Cramer who STOLE a basic PSG lick |
You're right, C. The greater part of Floyd's career was built upon imitating the most common E9 change.  |
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Tony Farr
From:
Madison, Tennessee, USA (deceased)
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 6:38 am
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| How about hooking up suround on to the TV (cable box) then turn up the music. You can hear everything. My wife hooked up one so my sister could hear the TV, she sets i and you don"t miss anything being played. |
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Roger Edgington
From:
San Antonio, Texas USA
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 8:14 am
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Maybe the ball is in our court. Just sounding good on TV isn't enough for the bulk of the viewers. We need to look alive and that we are having a great time. Bobby Koeffer told me "It don't matter if you've got Chet Atkins on stage if you can't sell it". Modern pedal steel has developed to the point that we are captured in a maze of strings,pedals,levers and other gadgets we all love to the point it is hard sometimes to react visually. To a camera man it's kind of like watching grass grow. I'm not saying we need to be a clown or anything, but it is probably a weak area for us in general.
This week I will be playing stand up non pedal steel with Floyd Domino at the Ruidoso,NM. Cowboy Symposium. One of the things I really enjoy is the freedom to move around and interact with others on and off stage.> |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 8:30 am
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Honestly, sometimes, I think the director just doesn't know what instrument is making that sound. Generally, there are several cameras focusing on several things at once, but it's not their call even if they're zoomed in on the steel. I don't know the tech name for the guy that calls camera shots, but he's the one who decides which shot you see.
There are things you can do to help though. Notice how Alan Jackson points to Robbie when he's about to do a turn or ride. Hard to ignore that.
I think we notice it more, because we are steel players. I see it a lot with other instruments as well. It's always annoying for a musician looking to see what the player is doing, or what brand of dobro, guitar, steel etc. he's playing. It's just what we gearheads do |
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Johnny Thomasson
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 8:57 am Re: Marty Stuart
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| Ray Riley wrote: |
| I just by chance watched Rfd's Marty Stuart's show. He introduced all his band and Gary Carter was on steel. When it came time to feature him on break,they had him so low in the mix I could not even hear him, and he was backing up Connie Smith. It looked like he was doing a good job but only the sound man knows for sure. Ray |
Ray,
I don't know how you have your TV sound set up, but it sounds like you're getting a mono audio signal. Do whatever you need to get stereo audio. I assure you, it will be worth the trouble. Gary is right up in the mix where he needs to be, and both his playing and tone are outstanding! The overall mix and audio quality of the Marty Stuart Show is excellent. With them mixing acoustic and electric instruments, I don't know how they do it. The Marty Stuart Show is the highlight of my week.
On topic, The Marty Stuart Show is one of few programs that do give the steeler proper recognition.
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Johnny Thomasson |
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Ben Jones
From:
Seattle, Washington, USA
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Posted 3 Oct 2010 9:46 am
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why do they show nothing but the guitar playing male models?
Girls wanna see em, guys wanna be em (cause the girls wanna see em).
Young people need to be able to relate to the band. To imagine that could be THEM Up there or that they could hang out with or date the person up there with the models looks and hot guitar licks.
NO idea who the steeler was or what he mighta looked like ,cause they never showed him or her, but IM guessing he was a tad heavier, a tad older, and a tad less beautiful looking than Bard Presley or Keith Suburban or Birks McGuinty or whomever they were badonka donkin up there. Even if it was fabio on the steel, he's sitting down and cant do any rock star moves. Its not much fun to air pedal steel guitar |
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