Hawaiian Lap Steel

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 19 Nov 1999 8:57 am

I promised everyone here at the shop that the 6 new product lines we released this year would be it.
BUT...
I have received a new Low Impedance type pickup that HAS that Hawaiian Steel sound on the money. I can't help myself, I've got to build a Hawaiian steel around this pickup. What should it look like guys. Pictures and details appreciated.

Ted

PS Their threatening to lock me up if I come up with "one more model!!"[This message was edited by MELOBAR GUITARS INC on 11-19-99]

Bill Leff · Post by **Bill Leff** » 19 Nov 1999 9:04 am

What Hawaiian steel sound are you referring to Ted? Frypan?

Gerald Ross · Post by **Gerald Ross** » 19 Nov 1999 9:35 am

Shaped like a Pre-WWII Gibson EH-150.

Sunburst would be nice too.

Jim Landers · Post by **Jim Landers** » 19 Nov 1999 9:52 am

Ted, I would like to see something with at least 2 necks, preferably 3, standing on 4 legs, that has the Fender or Rickenbacker tone.
I don't know how feasable it would be, but maybe something could be designed that could be added too when you felt the need. In other words, add more necks later. That way you could start with a basic 1 neck model and add necks later. If you used a bolt together system like Fender did, it looks to me like that might work.
That's just an idea, but it would be attractive to me. There are a lot of people that can't afford to spend the money for a new triple neck all at once, but as they outgrew a single, if they could add to it, that might be a real incentive to go with Melobar to begin with. What do you think?

Jim

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 19 Nov 1999 10:45 am

Bill, I'd have to say more like the Gibson sound Gerald mentioned, but it's not my ear, but some other players who turned me on to these pickups, who really are into that Hawaiian sound.
Gerald, do you have a detailed picture of that Gibson.
Jim,
We already have what you mentioned about to be made public, end of this month, on our web site. Called the Supersteel, I have 7 on the bench and in the paint booth sold right now by word of mouth. They are independent or "modular" necks shaped like a Stringmaster that each independently screw on our new stand with 2 thumbscrews. So just like you said, a player can buy one neck to start with, in any variable we offer, starting at $349. Then add a stand, another neck, another neck, another neck...with Dobroism, with interchangable pickup options, in 6-8-10 string...it really is neat.
But what I'm looking for is a unique kind of lap steel with a real Hawaiian sound for people who want that sound in a new instrument with Grover keys and up to date electronics. It will be available in the Supersteel. That is what's fun about the Supersteel, Mike Tatro got the Teleratt componants in one neck in White, and another neck with a Lawrence pickup in Black, looked hot. But he can take a neck off and use it jamming as a lap steel or change one to our CC-8 model or with...anything he wants.

You can see why I'm in the dog house on too many models. Making that Supersteel so it could do anything took over a year and a half to complete.

Ted

Peter Jacobs · Post by **Peter Jacobs** » 19 Nov 1999 12:15 pm

Ted --

How about following the design of a Weissenborn. That shape says "Hawaiian" to me (although if you ask the shop for rope binding, that may be the last straw!)

Still lovin' my LS 6 string...
PJJ

Gerald Ross · Post by **Gerald Ross** » 19 Nov 1999 1:26 pm

Ted,
Here is a picture of an EH-150.

Thanks to Brad's Page of Steel!

http://www.well.com/user/wellvis/steels ... EH-150.JPG

Put the controls on one side only. The tone
control near the picking hand gets in the way.
I was thinking a lap model, but it sounds
like you're thinking console.[This message was edited by Gerald Ross on 11-19-99]

mikey · Post by **mikey** » 19 Nov 1999 1:44 pm

I have to admit, even I would be tempted to buy a 6 or7 string EH-150 style instrument, Flametop, binding, sunburst...lapsteel, Chandler makes a Weiss shaped one already, I've owned one, sold it, didn't like it...altho, one thing I think someone should do, but it changes the lines of the instrument, is leave enough room behind the bridge, for a hipshot, multiple tuner....Will it be a 6 or 8? or like Gibson used to do, 6 string, additional strings would be extra...a 7 string would be nice.....
Aloha,
Mike[This message was edited by mikey on 11-19-99]

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 19 Nov 1999 2:21 pm

The Gibson has a smaller body than what I was thinking of. But that kind of stylized upper and lower bout, like Peter thinking a Weis'is what I think of when I think Hawaiian.

Chandlers' have that look and are nicely built instruments. I won't step on his toes at all, we agreed a couple of years ago to work together (I use his pickups and pickguards occasionally), just because we've had booths next to each other at the NAMM shows for years, but Paul has a rock n roll heart and he'll admit his guitars sound like rock guitars.

I'm thinking that fat lower bout Weis' look with a flame maple top, pearl binding, get Mikey to get us a line on some "Hawiian wood" so it actually has some of the Islands in it, and got to have a hula girl and a palm tree(Gold on Black),on the back. Dad used to have a decal with that and I can't find it, so anybody out there who can help us with a stencil like that, get a hold of me.
That's what I'm thinking but I'm open if there's something better.

Ted

PS Mike, we've always left room to install a Hipshot trilogy on all our lap steels, and Peter up there was I believe the first to put a Hipshot on a Melobar tilt neck, if it's the Peter Jacobs I know in Calif. And our old SLS model is going to be a 7 string with Barden pickups, should be ready next month, everything is on order for it. Haven't heard those pickups yet but I bet Lawrence will be making one soon too. [This message was edited by MELOBAR GUITARS INC on 11-19-99]

Jim Landers · Post by **Jim Landers** » 19 Nov 1999 3:10 pm

Ted, your Supersteel sounds like just what I was describing. When are you going to have pictures etc. available on it? I'm interested!
Jim

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 19 Nov 1999 3:49 pm

I'm working on them now and hope to have them finished in the next 10 days and start taking pictures of them. We have a lot of variety in this batch from traditional Stringmaster Yellow and a Yellow with Grain to Red, Black and white, and all pickup options, so it should make for a nice photo shoot, and that's when we'll get them over to the Webmaster to put under the lap steel page. At the same time we have a new Melobro BD model body coming out and will be taking pictures of them so it's really hopping right now. I pass by the computer from the paint booth to the work center is how I get in these little talks. Talking to people who are interested in this stuff helps keep me going when we're doing 14 hour shifts.
Ted

Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 19 Nov 1999 5:56 pm

Just for your information,there's a guy in L.A. named Asher I believe,who is building a sort of solid body Weissenbourn.Same size,shape,inlay,etc but only about 1&1/4" thick,and not too heavy so they may be chambered.They have 2 pickups which look like Gibson P-90s.They're beautiful and sound FAT and unique but are only available(as yet)in a 6 string.I saw one down at Voltage Guitars in Hollywood a couple days ago and put in a request for an 8 and/or 10 string version.People like Ry Cooder and David Lindley are going ape$h!t over them. -MJ-

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 19 Nov 1999 7:07 pm

Haven't seen or heard of them at the shows or anything. Did you get a price? If we don't need to build it, I'll let him know about the pickups.
Ted

Post by **Brad Bechtel** » 19 Nov 1999 8:23 pm

The guy Michael is talking about is Bill Asher of Guitar Traditions in Santa Monica.
Bill Asher's Guitar Traditions
1003 Broadway
Santa Monica, CA 90401
(310) 393-4420 voice
(310) 393-7994 fax

His lap steel is featured on the cover of the December 1999 issue of Guitar Player magazine being held by Ben Harper, who endorses and co-designed these guitars.

------------------
Brad's Page of Steel:
www.well.com/~wellvis/steel.html
A web site devoted to acoustic & electric lap steel guitars

Mike Tatro · Post by **Mike Tatro** » 20 Nov 1999 8:05 am

Ted, overall I *LOVE* my D6 SuperSteel (heck, it didn't even have a name last time I talked with you).

Regarding my minor dissatisfaction with the tele bridge saddles, the HipShot might be just the ticket. As I told you, I've made a major comittment to C6 on that neck, but A6 tunings/gauges are very close. The HipShot might just solve that minor saddle stability problem and provide more tuning options.

Guys, I just can't say enough great things about the tone of the Supersteel. The Lawrence humbucker is the *best* PU I've ever heard for the David Lindley type stuff (no more getting buried in the mix) and the TeleRatt neck has gobs of useful country tones. The instrument is remarkably resonant, stays in tune better than any steel I've ever played and is fairly light (no back problems with this bad boy). Just my .02, but I feel that Ted and company really nailed it this time.[This message was edited by Mike Tatro on 11-20-99]

Mike Tatro · Post by **Mike Tatro** » 20 Nov 1999 8:15 am

Regarding Bill Asher and company, I talked with one of his guys before I ordered my Supersteel from Melobar.

Basically they said, "Bill *might* build you a steel. However, there's no telling when you might get it or how much it would cost." Seriously, the guy I talked to wouldn't even commit to whether the price would be closer to $1K or $3K. I'm not making this up, that's how the phone conversation went down. Basically, it seemed to me that unless you *are* Ry Cooder, David Lindley or Ben Harper, you won't get treated with much respect.

Ted Smith on the other hand treated me with the utmost respect and courtesy and delivered a great product at a fantastic price. I couldn't be happier with my choice. It exactly met my needs.

When I pay up front sight unseen for a custom instrument, I like to have the deck stacked in my favor. I do this by dealing with honest forthright people. I've done it twice - once with Melobar and once with Michael Clark (tweed deluxe amp). Both experiences were exceedingly positive.[This message was edited by Mike Tatro on 11-20-99]

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 20 Nov 1999 9:36 am

Hi Mike, those Telecastor bridge saddles with light gauge strings and slightly slack tuning will wobble. The nice thing is since that is a stock Telecastor bridge we could exchange it out for the more square saddles which may work better with the tuning you are using. Email me and we'll be glad to do it.
On Asher I have to defend pricing (not attitude though, life's too short for that), You can imagine that this is a difficult way to make a living and if I was paying the L.A. overhead and dealing with Calif.EPA restrictions, our prices would be almost double. That and peaceful living is why I'm up here in the mountains. I will mail him a note on these low Imp. pickups because I liked that guitar on GPI's cover and was really tickled to see it there!
I have to agree with Mike on the sound of the Supersteel, it may replace 60% of what we are currently building, the usage flexibility, and the SOUND (there is something about that Stringmaster wood, scale etc.), it's going to spin some heads.

BTW thanks everybody for the emails and help on this, a lot of you have said you are mailing in pictures and ideas, I'll go over them and do a rough draft and come back on line with it. We will offer the sound in the Supersteel next month. Then shoot for January on a actual lap steel design if there is a desire for it from you guys.
Thanks again,
Ted

Cliff Swanson · Post by **Cliff Swanson** » 20 Nov 1999 10:14 am

Fellow Forumites... This doesn't really have anything to do with guitars per se, but I wanted to speak up in behalf of Ted Smith and the Melobar company. It should be obvious from recent posts Ted has made to the Forum that Melobar is serious about soliciting and attending to the needs of steel players. I can tell you from recent personal experience that Ted is completely committed to his word on customer satisfaction in any circumstance. Between having a great attitude about building cool sounding and great looking instruments that suit the players, AND conducting business honestly and to his word, Ted and Melobar ought to be a top contender on any steeler's short list of companies to contact for a new guitar and service.

Cat

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 20 Nov 1999 11:11 am

Thanks Cliff, I appreciate that, however those kind of comments scare me to death because then you have to live up to them!
I think we're just doing no more than what your suppose to do. It is fun being able to share it with people who like these instruments as much as we have for 3 generations now. Dad would have loved to have something like this to talk about ideas. The summer I spent in Alaska his favorite comment about the company was, "it's a lonely old world". Not anymore, can't wait till we all have computers that can actually send the sound of these guitars back and forth and play tunes together online. I hope it really pulls the slide fraternity out there together.

Peter Jacobs · Post by **Peter Jacobs** » 22 Nov 1999 7:03 am

Ted --

What you said, only double. Life's too short for negative stuff. One of the positive things about the Net is that it's exposed me to things I would know nothing about (except through word-of-mouth). Without this forum, for example, I wouldn't have known how strong and diverse the non-pedal community is.

I also have to echo the sentiments of others on this thread -- you're doing a tremendous job of supporting and promoting this community not only through your products (which are outstanding), but through your actions. So, while it may embarass you, I just have to say thanks -- it's very encouraging to see and conduct commerce with an honest, caring business person (my dad always conducted himself with dignity and honesty in his business dealings, and was always looking for ways to innovate. He is known throughout his industry for those qualities, so I understand your feelings about your father).

Best regards,
PJ

(By the way, I'm not the Peter Jacobs you're thinking of, although I have considered adding a Trilogy bridge to my steel. I'm in Northern Virginia, where I play banjo and Melobar steel with an acoustic-rock band)

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 22 Nov 1999 8:54 am

Thanks Peter, sorry to get you confused but it was with a very good 8-string dobro player, if that's any consolation. As a lot of you know, I can remember a guitar we built 20 years ago but can't remember a name for 30 minutes. So I apologize, I think it's because all my attention is always on some guitar and it'll start to take on a personality after you've spent so much time getting it to sing. Fortunately I have an understanding wife.
Rock n Roll banjo player...sounds like you're our kinda guy!!

Gerald Ross · Post by **Gerald Ross** » 22 Nov 1999 10:36 am

Ted,
One more suggestion. If this is to be a
console model on legs, make the legs come out
of the bottom of the guitar on an angle similar to the Stringmaster. It looks
better and offers more stability.

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 22 Nov 1999 2:07 pm

Thanks Gerald,
The Supersteel stand does have the same leg angle out as the Stringmaster. We felt the same way about the look and stability. We used the Dexco Steel guitar legs and they will telescope out high enough for a 6' person to stand comfortably and play.
The one thing I haven't figured out yet is how to get the legs to "clip' into the back of the stand, when in the case, AND guarantee they won't come loose and move around in the case. Currently we are building them with a leg box or bag seperate like most pedal steels, but in the carrying case.
I'll tell you, the stand has been the biggest challange and hang up! Being independent from the guitar necks it had to have strength but be light and inexpensive (right now it's $145 with the guitar purchase). And adapt from a single neck to a double neck, but that turned out well as you will see, with a nice spacer with inlay under the outside neck (you can also change the outside neck spacer to a higher or lower one, depending on how high you like the feel of the outside neck). The spacer is neat in that when you have a single neck, it acts as a cup, pick and bar holder, and you could screw on a music stand. The spacer can be painted like the Supersteel, or in contrast, or with your name...whatever. So it will be one more fun item to customize for the player.
There really was a lot of design work in it.
Ted

John Tipka · Post by **John Tipka** » 22 Nov 1999 6:39 pm

Ted,
I build cases that have four holes recessed 1" deep on each end of the long axis of the lid of the case. An end of a leg is placed into one of the holes, the leg is extended into the hole directly opposite it on the other end of the case, and then the leg clutch is tightened. The leg is now secure in the holes. (If the user is concerned about "losing the leg setting", a mark with a fine tipped marker along side of the bottom of the clutch on the leg shaft before the leg is stored is the reference used to restore the leg to the required length.)
I make the lid short sides from a piece of wood 1-1/2" square with a 110 degree dust seal that matches that of the long sides. The lid long sides and all of the case bottom sides are nominally 3/8" thick. The major sides are 5mm 7-ply Baltic Birch Aircraft grade plywood covered with Tolex. The lid's short sides provide for the anchor holes and also serve as a "hold-downs" that press against the rear side of a console-style guitar which is upside down in the case.

Regards,

John

MELOBAR GUITARS INC · Post by **MELOBAR GUITARS INC** » 22 Nov 1999 7:14 pm

Hi John,
If you can, send me a picture at ted@melobar.com, I'd really like to take a look and talk to you about a case like that. We have a custom ATA case and you can use keyboard cases from gig bags to hardshells, but a case like what you're describing really interest me. Are you building them to sell?
Ted