C6 question.

[Laurence Pangaro]

Hey there JK,

I'm not sure how appropriate viola da gamba repertoire would be on steel. I think it goes without saying that folks that play arcane instruments with an eye to playing music of the past in an authentic style might look at such efforts with skepticism, and yet... I did find myself trying to play some pieces by Marin Marais (French baroque viol da gamba composer) on a lap steel tuned in E7 yesterday. Maybe someday...

ciao,
LP

[Mike Neer]

My guess about the development of the C#m7 tuning and subsequent tunings containing minor triads is that the player was now able to play legitimate 9th chords. The development of this sound in steel guitar had to have been instigated by the love of the Jazz recordings they were hearing. Eddie Lang is a great example, as he really was all over that sound. Just the fact that the influence of Bix Beiderbecke was so heavy on many of the Hawaiians (Andy Iona, Sol Hoopii, just to name 2) there's no doubt in my mind that's what they were aiming for. I think the closer intervals of the C6 tuning creates infinitely greater possibilities, but listening to Hoopii you can surmise what his intentions were, even on the bass strings, where he often lived.

[Laurence Pangaro]

Hey, thanks for all the input guys! I loved all the music links. Very cool Byrd... Very cool Lang...

Mike, I see what you're saying and completely agree. When I first started looking at the question of tunings and strung an instrument up for C6, I thought that it must have evolved due to the convenience of having a major and minor triad. Later having looked at Hoopii's tuning and hearing more of the music of that period it became clear that these tunings were more a product of seeking an harmonic vocabulary popular in that era. Then the flexibility of the 6 tunings kept them in the game permanently and infected the harmonic vocabulary of musics prominently featuring steel. Sound about right?

I still don't have a clear handle on how folks arrived at C as a tonal center for tuning rather than the previously ubiquitous A and E. (Am I overestimating the prominence of A and E?) I guess I need to read Jerry Byrd's book. I also wonder if slack key players were using C tunings at this point. I believe they do today. Just musing here.

I guess in the end letter names as tonal centers are not really important; they're really more of a Western fixation. C6, A6, Q6..... it's all the same, but if C6 is a mainland tuning developed by white folks, a shift to C would make sense due to the universal Western music preference for C major as the central tonality.

Any more thoughts?

LP

[Alan Brookes]

Alan ... Have you ever built a viol?

Not yet, but I'll eventually work my way around to it.
http://www.7161.com/css_track.cfm?track ... k_id=19191
In the meantime here's the traditional She Moved Through the Fair, first movement on lute and rebec, second movement on cittern, hummel and tubular bells.

[Laurence Pangaro]

Alan,

More cool sounds! I've played some rebec as well. You're getting some neet sounds. It almost sounds like a sympathtic drone instrument. What kind of strings were you using?

Also... what's a hummel?

ciao,
LP

[Nils Fliegner]

My guess is that they settled on the key of C because the high "E" note was their reference that had to be retained.

The E and A tunings that preceded C6 all had the "E" as the top string (functioning as root or fifth respectivly) and so the "E" as a third was missing in the game. This coincided with the high note - E again - of the "spanish guitar" - a good reference point.

I feel that most people analyse tunings from the (low) root, but since lap steel playing is often harmonised melody lines or chord melody playing,
it is more telling to scrutinise the top note (= melody note) of any given tuning!

Just my two cents...

[Ron Whitfield]

Jerry Byrd, February 1939, on the Renfro Valley Barn Dance:

Just wondering if this is still Jerry Byrd backing the artists in the site's episode sample http://www.otrcat.com/renfro-valley-gat ... 48910.html
About 1/4 thru the show they have Wayne Turner come up to do Roses, and is the best shot of steel in the show.
After a couple of listens I'll say it's not, but whomever it is sounds to be playing a console and is good even tho there's not much steel to hear.

www.otrcat.com has great deals on tons of eclectic old shows like The Arthur Godfrey Show, many with hidden musical/etc. gems to be found, but the Grand Ol' Opry shows w/JB and Hollywood Barn Dance w/The Plainsmen and Joaquin are immediate must haves.

[basilh]

The A based tunings the E based tunings and the C based tunings on a three neck guitar, all with E as the top note, would cover all three inversions of a major chord.

The chronology of it is well documented, and in an encapsulated form of such, first came the A tunings followed by E based tunings Followed by C based tunings.

The Harlin MultiKord (first introduced) in 1937 was a changer guitar that incorporated all these varied inversions.

The Hawaiians were the initiators seemingly, when the three necked guitar appeared (pre 1940) and the norm seems to have developed as E6 or E13, C6 or C13 and A6 or B11th.


If one thinks about it, the present C6th trend with a G on top is nothing more than the original A6th "Up a Bit", likewise the E13th with a high G# is nothing more than the original C6th "Up a Bit". Both of which, having thin top strings would NOT have been favoured by the true Hawaiian Stylist. IMHO

[Alan Brookes]

...what's a hummel?

A Hummel is a Board Zither from the same family as the Mountain Dulcimer.

...now back to the C6 subject.