help on early 40s k&f lap steel made by leo fender

John David · Post by **John David** » 23 Jun 2010 9:26 pm

I PICKED UP THIS K&F LAP STEEL AND DID SOME RESEACH ON IT AND BELIVE IT WAS ONE OF THE FIRST GUITARS AND PICKUPS HANDMADE BY LEO FENDER IN THE EARLY 40S BEFORE HE STARTED FENDER. IVE BEEN TOLD THAT ITS RARE AND ONLY A FEW WERE MADE BEFORE HIS PARTNER DOC KAUFFMAN LEFT THE COMPANY AND LEO RENAMED THE COMPANY JUST FENDER. HAS ANYONE SEEN OR HEARD OF THIS THANKS JOHN

Billy Tonnesen · Post by **Billy Tonnesen** » 23 Jun 2010 10:15 pm

I was around in the early 40's and never knew of Leo producing a Lap Steel during this time. When he did start out it was making amplifiers primarily with 15" Speakers. I remember Leo and another cohert named Ray Massey starting out as a Radio Repair Shop on Spadra Blvd. (later renamed Harbor Blvd) in downtown Fullerton, Ca. Later he moved into a new small facility across from the Railroad Station where I think he started building Steel Guitars.

I hope someone else can verify if your picture, was indeed, a early Fender Lap Steel !

Richard Shatz · Post by **Richard Shatz** » 24 Jun 2010 6:11 am

It is indeed one of the early Fender lap steels but not the earliest.

Post by **Brad Bechtel** » 24 Jun 2010 7:49 am

They're rare, but not particularly rare. I see them come up regularly on eBay. Kaufmann and Fender made these in 1945 and 1946. This appears to be one of the later versions, with the curved body sides and metal nut.

A search for "K&F lap steel" on Google returns 38,000 results, including this link.
http://invention.smithsonian.org/center ... /02-08.htm

Any good history of the Fender guitar should mention this guitar at least in passing. Also look at Gruhn's Guide to Vintage Guitars, which describes this model in far more detail.

You can definitely see the influence of this model in the recent Fender FS-52 lap steel.

John Dahms · Post by **John Dahms** » 24 Jun 2010 4:25 pm

John,
As Brad mentioned K&F guitars were made in '45-46. Before we downplay how rare this might be I just want to point out that considering the hundreds of thousands of Fender guitars that have been built since 1946, having one of the first few hundred guitars still pretty damn exciting. That's hard to deny. These early guitars are crude and raw to be sure and lack the polish of old Gibsons or the style of Ricks and others but they played a big role in the beginning of one of the biggest and best instrument companies in history. Enjoy.

Barney Roach · Post by **Barney Roach** » 24 Jun 2010 8:03 pm

I have been told this is a lot earlier still,
but I am not up on these deeply. Yet.

Post by **Brad Bechtel** » 25 Jun 2010 6:35 am

Barney, that's an interesting looking lap steel, but it's not a Fender. Not no how, not no way.

Barney Roach · Post by **Barney Roach** » 25 Jun 2010 7:09 am

Barney, that's an interesting looking lap steel, but it's not a Fender. Not no how, not no way.

{ Once in a while, a blind squirrel can find an acorn. I was keying off the topic of K&F- and stand by my post.}

Barney Roach · Post by **Barney Roach** » 1 Jul 2010 6:09 pm

Darn. The poster just needed forum help to
assist in writing his eBay ad. (!)

http://cgi.ebay.com/VINTAGE-K-F-LAP-STE ... 2308436f14

Nicholai Steindler · Post by **Nicholai Steindler** » 1 Jul 2010 7:27 pm

Funny ebay ad.

I bet Gruhn knows the value.

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 1 Jul 2010 7:35 pm

He probably should have taken a moment to ask what the value really is. The Official Vintage Guitar Magazine Price Guide for 2010 values it at $800-$1000. See for yourself:

http://tinyurl.com/26l5le7

John David · Post by **John David** » 1 Jul 2010 7:37 pm

sorry i didnt mean to offend anybody i do love music and fenders. but i sell stuff on ebay to support my family. hard times here in michigan. i joined hoping to get some feed back. besides the story on k&f and stuff couldnt find anybody to talk to about it that knew about the guitar thanks for all your input john

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 1 Jul 2010 7:41 pm

You didn't offend anybody; you're just way off the mark. For what it's worth, it's hard times everywhere. I've had to sell many instruments I didn't want to this year. I hope you get what you need for it.

John David · Post by **John David** » 1 Jul 2010 7:50 pm

thats good cause i started to feel kinda bad guess i should be closer to a $1000.00 or so . i honestly thought it was rarer than what it is and had more of a history value got all happy when i read the storys about it and saw it in the smitsonian and all that.then i started thinking if a first years of the telecasters go for a crap load this must me worth alot too.

Jamie O'Connell · Post by **Jamie O'Connell** » 1 Jul 2010 11:29 pm

I don't think you're off the mark at all. I'm sure a collector wouldn't mind snatching it up at your BIN price, Most of the people here are players, not collectors, and don't sweat about getting a fry pan pickup rewound or replacing frozen pots etc.

Your offering looks very clean and I hope you get your price.

--Jamie

John David · Post by **John David** » 2 Jul 2010 5:21 am

thanks jamie but i think these guys were talking about when i first listed it i had it at 8000.00 not 1200.00

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 2 Jul 2010 6:17 am

Good luck with your sale. I think you got it right this time.

John David · Post by **John David** » 2 Jul 2010 10:54 am

thanks

Nicholai Steindler · Post by **Nicholai Steindler** » 2 Jul 2010 11:00 am

Yeah, at that price, if I had extra cash around I'd pick it right up.

Thank's Mike! That happens to be the page with my c-530 on it, I was wondering what it would be worth in mint! (which it pretty much is). Saved me $50.