When you can't play simple licks in practice

Paul Sutherland · Post by **Paul Sutherland** » 20 Oct 2009 10:17 pm

What do you do when you are trying to practice but you can't seem to play the simplest of licks without making mistakes? Do you stop playing, so you don't reinforce the mistakes, or do you keep playing, to try to play your way out of the funk?

I've had a hell of a time today with the C-6th neck. I finally stopped playing it and went back to the E-9 neck, just to get some playing in that didn't sound like Ka-Ka.

Rick Campbell · Post by **Rick Campbell** » 20 Oct 2009 10:50 pm

At times I've often tried everyway I could think of to play a lick, without success, so I'd finally just forget about it for awhile. Then one night while doing a show and having some freedom in what I played, the lick would just show up out of nowhere. Must be some kind of mental develop that takes place when we're not thinking about. Or maybe it a spirit thing WOOOOO WOOOOOOOO

Clete Ritta · Post by **Clete Ritta** » 21 Oct 2009 12:13 am

Slow down till its right, then speed up to tempo slowly.

Roual Ranes · Post by **Roual Ranes** » 21 Oct 2009 4:34 am

Boy does this hit home!
I go over and over these things just hoping it will change........not much does.
I usually practice until I can't stand to hear me anymore.

Jack Dougherty · Post by **Jack Dougherty** » 21 Oct 2009 5:56 am

Paul....

This may help....or not....

But learn to play through the mistakes. You would be very surprised at the things you could end up with.
I have often found things as a result of an odd note or two that at times don't sound half bad. When your guitar starts giving you lemons, sell lemonade.
There are not that many notes in the scale. You will always be close to the one your looking for.

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 21 Oct 2009 6:46 am

FWIW, when I'm struggling like that, I just walk away for awhile. If I'm trying to learn a new song or phrase, then I try to work my way through it to at least the basic point and come back to it when I feel better.

After nearly 30 yrs., I can sit down sometimes and everything sounds beautiful....at other times it's a chore. An enigma for sure.

I think it happens to nearly everyone at times.

Reece wrote a very insightful article about practice and how to prepare yourself for optimum results, though I don't know where to find it at the moment.

Andy Sandoval · Post by **Andy Sandoval** » 21 Oct 2009 7:53 am

I do it like Clete said. You just have to slow it down till you can play it right then slowly speed it up to the tempo your goin for.

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 21 Oct 2009 8:08 am

Paradiddles, per Buddy Emmons in a Guitar Player Magazine column.

Steve English · Post by **Steve English** » 21 Oct 2009 8:21 am

This might be the one Cal's referring to:

Q: What exercises do you like to do before you practice? Play? Some detail about riffs, chords, finger exercises would be great.

BE: One I use is similar to a drummers warmup. Find a string that you can play a unison with like strings 3 and 4 with your bar on the 3rd fret of the 4th string and play T 2 TT 2 T 22 over and over. There are others but this one is the easiest. After a while, change to lower strings because the hand position is different when not supported by the wound strings. Also try the same thing with string 3 and 5 with the bar on fret 5 of the 5th string.

This widens your hand spread and gives it a workout for licks you'll be using those spacings for. Then on to the 6th string with string 3. Unisons are all over the place.

After you have that down, use strings 3, 4, 5, and 6 on C6 with the thumb raking strings 5 and 6 and fingers 1 & 2 on strings 3 & 4. This gets the first finger involved. A more difficult example is TT 22 T 2 TT 22 TT 2 T 22 and so on.

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 21 Oct 2009 8:52 am

That's it, Steve.

Bo Legg · Post by **Bo Legg** » 21 Oct 2009 9:06 am

Geez, I can't believe you're trying to learn a lick before you read "The Gospel According to Buddy"

Ray Montee · Post by **Ray Montee** » 21 Oct 2009 8:37 pm

I realize I'll likely get seriously flamed from some of the newer Chat-Room players from the 1980's for my comments that follow but.....

Is it possible that practicing someone elses' LICKS..........is not really a productive way to go? Like studying tabs..............WHY?

You're in many cases attempting to copy-cat something that someone else quite different from yourself.......created out of the fresh juices of their very own minds.

Perhaps they were lazy and did a certain lick the only way that popped into their head at the time. OR, maybe they were having a good day and couldn't again duplicate the very same lick your attempting to master. Music is that way; it's self-expression.

WHAT YOU PLAY should be inherrant to the song you are attempting to play. It should be a part of that song and more so, a part of your own deep rooted spirit.

I believe too many thousands of hours of otherwise creative playing has been wasted by those attempting to play what another personality FELT in a song that you might never have the opportunity to play in your own local band.

But then again, with 66 years of radio, dance hall, television and recording studio playing experience, it's safe to assume I have no idea of what I'm talking about, right? In my lifetime, I at one time could play more than 100 steel guitar instrumentals just like Speedy West, Billy Robinson, Jerry Byrd,
Roy Wiggins, Don Helms, etc,. etc. Aside from the personal satisfaction of being able to do it, the reward was extremely small as none of the bands I participated in, could/would play any of those great instrumentals........vying instead, for Ring of Fire,
and hundreds of other plinky, plinky vocals.

Jeff Hyman · Post by **Jeff Hyman** » 21 Oct 2009 9:03 pm

Paul,
The issue applies to both C6 or E9. I interpret your focus on C6. For me, I gave up on C6 back in the very beginning... decades ago. Some would justifiably say I missed the boat... but I've got to tell you, all the chops I need are on the E9. Now, as far as sitting down and learning chops off a record and getting frustrated, I simply move to another song and revisit the difficult song later. Also... put your own flavor and touch into the mix. A little mod won't hurt.

Let me give you an example. Here are a few comparisons on the same song, with different chops. All are good, and the live versions are ones I personally prefer (in most cases):

All I have to offer you is me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r70RAYpQp44
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jlI23st ... re=related

Lonesome Onry and Mean:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V13y7n49 ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qzctdbS ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1mw4ImM ... re=related

Grab a little here, a little there... and add your own touch.

Jerry Eilander · Post by **Jerry Eilander** » 21 Oct 2009 9:38 pm

Ray, you got it "spot on".
been saying it for years, good to read that,
cheers from "Down under".

Paul Sutherland · Post by **Paul Sutherland** » 21 Oct 2009 9:49 pm

What started this rant was when I couldn't play open string scales on the C-6th neck despite slowing down to a snail's pace. I was not learning anything new; I was just working on fundamentals.

I think I made the correct choice in switching to something I was more comfortable with, the E-9 neck. I messed around in Huey-land for awhile and everything was better. My steel playing is greatly affected by my emotions. When I get too down on myself its time to do something different. Does that sound familiar?

I love the paradiddles!! Got any more?

Paul

Ronnie Boettcher · Post by **Ronnie Boettcher** » 22 Oct 2009 8:31 am

I just call it a brain f*rt. I think we all have days that everything fits, and some days, no matter what you play is awful. As you play on different days, the lick will all of a sudden appear, and will be perfect. Hang in there.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 22 Oct 2009 8:45 am

Not being able to play a simple lick is not a problem. Not having food to eat is a problem. Not having a place to live is a problem. Losing someone you love or care for is a problem. Put your steel playing "problems" in perspective...and count your blessings.

Quit playing for a week or two and do something else. Help someone, visit someone, write that letter or make that phone call you've been putting off for years. The steel (and that simple little lick) will be there when you return.

Adam Fastman · Post by **Adam Fastman** » 22 Oct 2009 8:52 am

I am maybe responding more to Ray than to the initial post but hey

Ray Montee wrote:
Is it possible that practicing someone elses' LICKS..........is not really a productive way to go? Like studying tabs..............WHY?

You're in many cases attempting to copy-cat something that someone else quite different from yourself.......created out of the fresh juices of their very own minds.

When I started learning C6 I downloaded a lot of tabbed licks... The tuning seemed to be a lot different than the open E I was used to so I figured I'd see how some other guys played on it.

After a few hours of that I could play a couple licks but I realized I had learned basically squat about the tuning. It was still an alien to me even though I could make some sounds come out of it robotically

So instead I sat down and....

made a bunch of CHARTS!

Yes on large graph paper I drew out my neck, labelled the strings, and drew in every note in the C major scale. Then I just looked at that for half an hour going "ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh". Picked a few more scales and did the same thing. It makes sense now. (It is still an alien).

It took a long time to draw these charts out by hand, but I did them that way anyway.

This approach is not going to directly teach me to play licks "just right" for covering tunes. It IS acquainting me with the tuning at a very basic level. Not learning "Hawaiian style in C6" or "Blues in C6" but just raw C6, "here is how to find a note on this tuning when you know what note you need."

Presumably down the line a good understanding of the tuning it will make it easier to learn "someone else's part" for a tune, but the goal is to be able to integrate that into my own playing in an organic way (by understanding it), not to keep someone else's licks as a separate category off to the side of my own playing and robotically play them back.

That being said, the bands I play in are not cover bands, and we don't spend much attention on playing it the same every time. We do try to play it well every time.

Does that make sense gentlemen? I think this is my first post!

Steve English · Post by **Steve English** » 22 Oct 2009 9:27 am

Ray's probably forgot more than I'll ever be capable of learning.

That being said, I do believe that if I can figure out a lick a much superior player/artist/technician has created, it might give me some insight into the process so that I might improve my own creative (:lol:) attempts.

I think thoughout most of our lives we learn by emulating others.

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When you can't play simple licks in practice

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