Michael Jackson - Dead at 50

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 26 Jun 2009 1:23 pm

Looks like Madonna spent alot of time on "The Stairmaster" and she wants us to know about it. Nice thighs there.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 26 Jun 2009 1:44 pm

A once-in-a-lifetime entertainer, amazing talent, worldwide fame and success, with an unfortunate dark side. Yes, his behavior was odd and there were rumors of molestation... and he was acquitted of all charges.

This is a time to reflect on the positive aspects of Michael's life and work, the joy and message of love he brought to millions of people worldwide through his music and dance. I am shocked at some of the hateful, ignorant replies I see on this Forum sometimes, and I wonder if such hatred has little to do with Michael Jackson and goes deeper and further back. Such comments are embarrassing to see on a music forum, and they shame the Steel Guitar Forum, in my opinion.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 26 Jun 2009 2:55 pm

Doug I couldn't have said it better, I read both of the threads here with regard to the death of MJ, I am wondering who we have become .

M Jackson was indeed very talented and rightfully earned his place in music history. Odd and eccentric, yes, but that's not criminal, he was hiding from his own life which was stolen away from him at a very young age. I have no way of knowing what his life was like, I cannot judge him based on my lack of knowledge.

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 26 Jun 2009 3:18 pm

Amen, Doug.

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 26 Jun 2009 4:11 pm

Doug Beaumier wrote:I am shocked at some of the hateful, ignorant replies I see on this Forum sometimes, and I wonder if such hatred has little to do with Michael Jackson and goes deeper and further back. Such comments are embarrassing to see on a music forum, and they shame the Steel Guitar Forum, in my opinion.

Well said. It's not only on this forum, unfortunately, as I'm sure you're aware of Doug.. Earlier tonight I posted this on another guitar forum:

It's amazing how the life and death of 'famous people' can make otherwise reasonable people gossip and gloat like a bunch of tranquilized old women at tea time.

Michael Dene · Post by **Michael Dene** » 26 Jun 2009 4:51 pm

Doug B., you said it perfectly.

Scott Hay · Post by **Scott Hay** » 26 Jun 2009 5:03 pm

if you got something bad to say about MJ.... "just beat it"

Amen Doug. For the record - I'll be wearing my Victory tour half shirt to the ISGC .

LJ Eiffert · Post by **LJ Eiffert** » 26 Jun 2009 7:19 pm

It's ashame so many people are wrong when they're right & so many are right when they are wrong.The only person who can judge you is yourself. If anybody knows you better than anybody it's yourself. Just like Keith Whitley,Elvis,Mel Street,Karen Carpenter and so many others in this music business world,you pay the price to be who you are and what you stand for.So,don't be so sure of what people say or write is true cause it will

,you sooner or later.RIP MJ your old helped you with BUBBLE friend,Leo J.Eiffert,Jr.

Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 26 Jun 2009 10:32 pm

He was a great entertainer,a great dancer and a pretty good though not great singer - but he had a style all his own and his success cannot be denied. My wife who is a woman of color as many of you know,worked for the Jackson family,Motown Records and was Diana Ross' personal assistant for years so I know way too much about Michael's dark side and it was all true and even worse than you can imagine I can assure you. I have a feeling that now that the paychecks have stopped,there will be many,many books written by his former sycophants and all that will be eventually be told. Still,I hated to see him go the way he did - pretty much like Elvis - a guy who had outlived his prime and wasn't cut out to get old so he stayed high and in denial. Very sad. R.I.P.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 27 Jun 2009 12:48 am

Back in the 90's, my close friend Jim and his family met MJ in San Francisco area,they were somehow staying at the same Hotel or Cottage, something like that. MJ was there in incognito, they met him quite by accident. Over a two day period they spoke with MJ a few times, once for over a half hour. My friends impression was that he was speaking with a child as MJ was really very immature, very friendly, very courteous , very polite, but acting very young. He kept responding to my friend with Yes Sir and his wife with Yes Ma'am. MJ was alone and basically had nobody to hang with, he appeared very lonely so Jim says. They would speak to MJ outside, MJ was standing outside his room on his 2nd floor balcony while they were on the ground floor. My friend wrote him a note and left it for him when they left the Hotel, about 6 months later they received a package at there home in Florida from MJ thanking them for being just normal people and just allowing him to talk to them without going nuts.

So is it safe to say that MJ basically had no friends and had no social or personal interaction with anyone who was not "connected" to MJ the entertainer ? It's no wonder he was so messed up. I think it's down right sad myself. Imagine for a moment, any of us, going thru our entire life from early childhood with no contact with anyone other than a business manager or tour director. Everyone around MJ was connected to the entertainer, not MJ the person. I guess most of the people around MJ were paid to be there.

Dave Hopping · Post by **Dave Hopping** » 27 Jun 2009 7:40 am

I don't think I ever heard steel on J5 or MJ material.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 27 Jun 2009 7:54 am

All I know is Doogie Hauser never dangled his kid over a hotel balcony for a publicity stunt. Is Doogie still alive or did he O.D.? And how about those thighs on Madonna? Yauzza!

John Macy · Post by **John Macy** » 27 Jun 2009 9:12 am

From Bob Lefsetz's newsletter...

The King Is Dead

He missed his childhood and now he’s gonna miss his old age.

How f***** up is that?

Michael Jackson never had a chance. He had to succeed for his family, his parents’ dreams were dependent upon him.

And a boy with that much pressure delivers. He works truly hard, so he will be loved. That’s all Michael Jackson was looking for, love.

He wanted to be accepted. Wanted to be so good that he couldn’t be denied. But you can’t change family history, and the public no longer treats you as human, as an equal, once you break through. People want to rip you off or tear you down, or shower you in faux love that’s more about their unfulfilled desires than yours. It gets so confusing that you retreat.

The Jackson 5 broke through at the tail end of the sixties. When both Motown and Top Forty radio were in decline. But the burst of energy known as "I Want You Back" could not be denied. And the continuous singles made Michael Jackson a star.

He sang a horror movie theme. He endured puberty. He was a faded child star. Then, suddenly, he released a dance floor epic. When disco was supposedly dead, Michael Jackson and Quincy Jones concocted a synthesis of rock and beats that could not be denied. Few were paying attention when "Off The Wall" was released. But over the course of two years, word spread. This was an album that could be played endlessly, that made you feel exuberant, totally alive. We didn’t stop listening because we could never get enough.

Then came "Thriller".

There are indelible television moments. When there’s only before and after. Michael Jackson’s "Motown 25" moonwalk was one of those events. Akin to the landing of Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin on the moon over a decade before. MTV was AOR. Dancing was something you saw on Broadway. Give Walter Yetnikoff credit, he forced MTV to play Michael Jackson and not only was the color barrier broken, not only did videos turn into extravaganzas, the biggest star since the Beatles was hatched, fifteen years after Michael had first gained public notoriety, years after he’d started performing. It’s "Outliers" in action. Michael Jackson made it look easy. But there were far in excess of 10,000 hours involved. When everybody was finally paying attention, no one else was close. You had newbie bands from the U.K. who could barely sing, never mind play. And you had this phenomenon prancing on screen fully realized. It was like the 1927 Yankees playing a Little League team.

And then it was over.

There was another album with Q, but it was a step down. There’s nowhere to go from the top but down. But Michael Jackson couldn’t accept this. Everything had to be bigger and better. A musician’s career can last forever. But to have those legs, you’ve got to have perspective. Existing at the center of the hurricane, unable to step outside the maelstrom, means that you have no frame of reference.

Not that you can’t buy one. Or that hucksters and shysters don’t try to give you one. You trust everyone but know you can trust no one. You’re a party of one. What means so much to everybody else means almost nothing to you. You don’t want to give up your money and fame, but they don’t buy you peace of mind, they don’t buy you love, they don’t keep you warm at night.

It’s been a sad movie that’s been unspooling. We can delineate the low points. But let’s just say it started with plastic surgery and it ended with court cases. Michael Jackson just didn’t think he was good enough. And when he tried to explain, when he showed up in court in his pajamas, we didn’t want to listen, we didn’t want to give him a break, we just wanted to make fun of him, deride him.

Michael Jackson was an entertainer until the very end.

It’s just that his latest gigs were not inside theatres, but played out on "investigative" television shows and gossip Websites. Everybody was living off Michael Jackson. He gave good ratings. He rescued the hoi polloi from a life of drudgery.

But that’s all over now.

Sony can be thrilled that the digital marketplace insures there’s endless inventory for those sitting shiva to buy. And they’re going to end up with the Beatles catalog too. But we’ve lost something with the passing of Michael Jackson. A belief that America is a good-hearted place, a supportive place, where we want everybody to have a good life and be happy.

Wonder about the price of fame? Just look at the miserable Jon & Kate. Never mind their eight children.

We did this to Michael Jackson. And there wasn’t a single person who could save him. He was too isolated.

We’ll remember where we were when we heard the news. But I’d rather remember that explosion emanating from the radio back in ‘69.

Michael, we want you back! We want to see you moonwalk one more time! We want you to sing "Billie Jean"!

Alas, that’s impossible.

As he once sang, "now it’s much too late for me to take a second look."

The king is dead.

Long live the king.

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 27 Jun 2009 11:45 am

Excellent John !

LJ Eiffert · Post by **LJ Eiffert** » 27 Jun 2009 3:49 pm

Well,like my little six years old ask me? Daddy,if Jesus is God, why did he create his own mother? I couldn't answer he! And,this is how I feel about MJ's ending of his life. His children will live out what he did and that's sad for them. We are all is the same boat in a special way of life with our families. To sad but,true.

Leo J.Eiffert,Jr. PS: Maybe I'm next!

Archie Nicol · Post by **Archie Nicol** » 27 Jun 2009 3:57 pm

Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 27 Jun 2009 4:38 pm

PS: Maybe I'm next!

Ya just nevah know......

Calvin Walley · Post by **Calvin Walley** » 27 Jun 2009 4:45 pm

what the hell is this world coming to when a person can be $400 million in debt
and we have pertty good reason to suspect he was a child molester .look like a freak

and folk's think he walks on water just because he could sell records and dance

you KNOW this next statment is true as rain

if this were ANYONE else we would call them irresponsable
a pervert and a freak
and
we would be demanding this person be locked away

Dean Salisbury · Post by **Dean Salisbury** » 27 Jun 2009 7:05 pm

In our great nation we are suppose to treat people as though they are innocent until proven guilty. Yet, we let our elected representatives; lie; cheat; have affairs; screw everyone who disagrees with them and most of all we just sit in our kitchens and bitch about the jobs they are doing. At the same time we keep electing these no good bums into office.

MJ may have committed the crimes he was charged with. However, with our form of justice may it be right or wrong he was aquitted by his peers of all allegations. Yet some have the nerve without having any personal facts, not hearing the evidence in a court of law that the jury heard to come to another conclusion! May you be brought up on charges of which you may be innocent of and be found not guilty and then have the general public act just like you do?

Many men and women have died for you to have those rights and freedoms that the bill of rights have given us. Don't know about you, but I have been in two branches of the armed forces and I've taken more then two oaths to protect and defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic! Whether a disagree or agree with a juries verdict their verdict is the law of the land! You don't like it then I have an easy answer MOVE!

Thousands of men and women died for the right that we all who live n the U.S. have certain rights and one of them is to be tried by our peers!

May MJ finally R.I.P. He was an icon to millions. Are you an icon? What have you did to be remembered? Look at your own life! Are you a saint? I highly doubt it. Who of us are? What is in your closet? Think about it! All of us have something in our closets that we are not proud of so who are we or you to judge another?

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jun 2009 8:03 pm

Calvin Walley wrote:...we have pertty good reason to suspect he was a child molester .look like a freak

Calvin, You really have no idea who Michael Jackson was do you? You know Nothing about his life's work, the barriers he broke worldwide through his music since the 1960s. But you don't care about any of that, do you? All you know about him is the tabloid stuff... all of it proven false in a court of law. You say "...we have pertty good reason to suspect he was a child molester .look like a freak" Let's hope that if anyone in Your family is ever accused of a crime he will be presumed innocent until proven guilty, and will not be condemned because "we have pertty good reason to suspect" something, or he ".look like a freak".

Despite the negativity in some quarters, something very positive has been happening in the past couple of days. People are seeing clips on TV of Michael Jackson performing in his younger days and are they are gaining a new appreciation for him, and starting to see him in a new light, especially young people. I believe MJ, much like Elvis, will be remembered as he was in the Prime of his career. Remembered for the good, for the positives... and the negatives will fade and become a footnote in his incredible story. This will happen in spite of the few, like Calvin, who prefer to wallow in negativity.

Calvin Walley · Post by **Calvin Walley** » 27 Jun 2009 8:17 pm

Doug
1st let's get something straight .you can not tell me to "get off the forum " its is a place for differing views
mine is as valid as yours

i do NOT have any problem with him being black
thats your words NOT mine

but i did have problem with him "trying to change colors" to me THAT was the freaky part of him

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 27 Jun 2009 8:32 pm

Settling out of court for $20 mill is GUILTY, period. Does anyone in their right mind believe it isn't? I agree with you absolutely Calvin. It was a freak show! John Macy, that was some par excellent writing, although I don't agree with all of it I think you have an excellent analysis the of the life of a super star.
Also lets get something straight. Michael Jackson
A) Wrote NONE of his own hits I and don't tell me Billy Jean. I don't beleive it even though his name is on it).
B) Choreographed NONE of his own dance routines.
C) The "Moon Walk was "invented" by Marcel Marceu in the 1940's! You can go to Youtube and see a dancer named Bill Bailey doing it in the 50's. It probably goes back further than Marceu.
D) He was a puppet creation of the Pop media using him to make big bucks. He planned NOTHING. Thats a fact. Did the guy have some talent? Yeah. Was he well produced for his time? Yeah. Was he a musical genius as some people are calling him? That a total laugh.
This is being hyped by a generation who sat in their baby strollers while their mothers force fed this guys records (disco crap)to them in the 80's. He was a CREATION, and there is a GREAT deal to be negative about.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jun 2009 8:38 pm

Calvin, I edited my reply before you posted. But since you responded to my initial reply, I will respond. Yes, I think you are baised against MJ for a number of reasons after reading your ugly comments about him... I went too far with the black comment, which is why I edited it immediately.

As far as "Get Off the Forum"... yes, I stand by that. If you can't post here in a decent, appropriate way you should Not be on this Forum.

At least one forum Moderator feels the same way. Here is what Joey Ace said to Calvin today:

Show some respect for this Forum and the volunteers that bring it to you.

If you can't do that you shouldn't be here.

Any members can click on "search" above, enter Calvin's name under "Seach for Author" and read some of the hateful replies he has posted on this Forum in the past couple of days. His replies shame this forum, and they might violate forum rules.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jun 2009 8:41 pm

It was a freak show!

So... we should throw a man in prison because he's a freak? What law did he break?

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 27 Jun 2009 8:43 pm

Kevin Hatton wrote:Settling out of court for $20 mill is GUILTY, period.

Now I don't have $20 mill to spend, but I I were faced with those kind of charges - where you're basically "guilty until proven innocent" in the eyes of most people, as demonstrated here and on other forums - yes, I think I would have paid up if I were naive enough to believe it would make it all go away.

The Steel Guitar Forum

Michael Jackson - Dead at 50

Its funny how people react