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Topic: BMI/Show Cancellation |
Larry King
From:
Watts, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 3:13 am |
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| I have worked at Cowskin Prairie since 1998 and John Terry has worked there 21 yrs..and..we are (were, as in past tense) scheduled there again on Sat the 26th of April. While I'll admit I'm repeating info second or third hand, the message I received was "we are cancelled due to a phone call from a BMI rep demanding $1000. for performing licensed music". I hope this is not the wave of the future for live music but am curious enough to ask if anything similiar to this has ever happened to you..and how did you handle it? Thanks for the help. |
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Bill Edwards
From:
Centerton, AR
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 5:06 am
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wow I sure hate to hear this had the old dancing boots all polished up ready to go haha
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Randy Beavers
From:
Lebanon,TN 37090
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 7:25 am
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| Larry, tell them you only play songs licensed by ASCAP? |
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Ken Lang
From:
Simi Valley, Ca
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 8:40 pm
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I have been a registered member of BMI for several years as a publisher and a songwriter. This picking on a small place is a disgrace to all concerned. It seems the performance rights people get a burr under their saddle now and again. More than likely, it's a new putz feeling his power. This crap has been going on for years and years.
Once in the 60's a bar I was working in got the same run around except it was ASCAP, BMI and SESAC together, all demanding outrageous sums and the lions share for each of them.
The owner said when you can come back with legal data supporting your positions, we'll talk. Untill then, Get out. They never came back.
Tell that young lion the same thing. This would require they sit in the place for several weeks and write down every song played. Rarely would they do that for a small club. To be sure, some places have been busted, but it requires a great effort and a lot of work to make it legal. No way can they come in and demand an arbitrary sum of money. An alternative is to offer about 10% of what they ask just to make them go away.
Now I'm not a legal expert, so don't quote me as that. These are just some things I have seen that work pretty well.
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John Macy
From:
Rockport TX/Denver CO
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 9:07 pm
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It's federal law.
It's simple--if the music has no value, and is not worth paying for, then don't play music in the club. If it has value, and draws patrons into the establishment, then it has value, and you have to pay for it. Or hire all-original bands (I like that  ). If you play in a cover band, you're making your money by playing other people's tunes--without them, you would not be gigging.
The amounts are not arbitrary--there is a fixed schedule based on many factors such as seating, whether there is a cover charge etc. I suppose all things are negotiable.
This always seems to get passed off on the record companies, but they have nothing to do with this, The songwriters are the beneficiaries. It's not a perfect system, but it's what we have at the present. |
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David Reeves
From:
Florida
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Posted 24 Apr 2003 9:19 pm
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[This message was edited by David Reeves on 25 April 2003 at 08:22 AM.] |
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Danny Naccarato
From:
Burleson, Texas
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Posted 25 Apr 2003 2:38 am
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I saw the invoices from ASCAP AND BMI for a local large club here. THe owner is incensed. ASCAP was reasonable...about 1k. But BMI is billing him based on capacity, even though the club only books bands on one night, which is their slow night.....$7600.00!!!! They don't sell albums,etc.
He is going to stop booking bands on that one night now..... |
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Larry King
From:
Watts, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 25 Apr 2003 3:28 am
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| To Danny....and this begs the question..will this lead to the eventual demise of live music as we know it. Furthermore, I think if you walked up to Merle and said, " I'm gonna sing Silver Wings tonight", he would say OK..not where's my cut? I don't know who's to blame, I only know that we had to email our base customers and notify them of the cancellation. So where does that leave us? should we not post our schedules for fear the song police will show up? I dunno. |
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John Macy
From:
Rockport TX/Denver CO
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Posted 25 Apr 2003 7:15 am
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Hi David,
When you said "BMI does not come into the picture unless you are selling albums, and then only if 10,000 copies or more are sold.", you are very mistaken. BMI licenses performance venues as well as ASCAP, and songwriter royalties are due from the first record sold... |
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David Reeves
From:
Florida
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Posted 25 Apr 2003 7:22 am
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Thank you for all the legal expertise.
I retract any statement that I have previously made.
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Al Marcus
From:
Cedar Springs,MI USA (deceased)
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Posted 25 Apr 2003 7:53 am
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I remember when an ascap guy came into the club where my band was playing. the boss warned us.
Soooo we played all public domain songs, like "Old Black Joe" "londonerry air", and BMI tunes. The guy listened to one Set and left in disgust. We had a good laugh about it.
Although ,They are representing the Song Writers and trying to get their royalties for them. There is nothing wrong with that , as long as they don't go overboard on the small club owner.
Bill Stafford did a CD called "Going Home" on his steel, which he calls his "Electric Harp". He plays all those tunes beautifully, and I reccomend that you all get it. A new direction for steel players. I like it....al |
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