Moving to Nashville

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 29 Aug 2008 1:23 am

Tommy R. Butler wrote:
Damir Besic wrote:there is ONE good thing about Nashville that I know for sure, it is the best place to find a kick a$$ deals on instruments at the pawn shops... $:\$

Db

AMEN TO THAT. I just bought a PP Emmons for $300

Damir & Tommy

I asked a taxi driver to take me a pawn shop in Nashville earlier this year. He mistakenly thought I said a PORN shop. Must have been my accent. When I did eventually visit a couple, the owners knew the value of every musical instrument that they had. A push pull for $300??? Someone must have been starving to let a guitar go for that money. Mr Seymour would surely have paid more than that for it.

Jamie will find that accommodation, transportation and food is far cheaper than it is in the UK. The biggest thing that he will have to work on is networking. Lloyd Green found this when he first got into the recording business.

J D Sauser · Post by **J D Sauser** » 29 Aug 2008 5:32 am

It reminds me when I wanted to go live in the States. I was then living in Ecuador and interested in moving on (I am not FROM Ecuador). I had traveled to Nashville, Miami and Dallas where I met Maurice Anderson. I remember well being at his home and in between lessons sharing stories about our lives and my desire to live in the US and the memory of Maurice's words staid with me for many years and certainly contributed to my decision to not just try it but to DO it: "If you want to do it legally, I understand it may be tough but if you set your mind up to it and do it RIGHT, I am sure YOU CAN DO IT."

I entered the US on a VWP (visa waiver program), which is NOT a visa, but exactly the contrary. You also waive your "right" to apply for a different visa or extension once you enter on a VWP, in other words you can NOT extend NOR convert it into a resident application, business or student visa while in the US!

We (me, my wife and first child) knew that, but for the purpose of leaving Ecuador quickly as it found itself in a political turmoil, this was the way we chose to start.

Once in the States, it was suggested to us to try to obtain a business visa by either buying an existent business or build our own. I tried to buy out a very well know steel guitar manufacturing company and when negotiations failed, I built my own real estate developing company, which now I know was a better choice. I must admit, I was fortunate to already have more money than USD 10K to invest and live on at first. We had to leave to apply for ouf visa and used an excellent immigration lawyer out of Fort Lauderdale. Legal fees for obtaining our business visa including all application fees: USD 12K and that in 1996!
We said until 2001 and left because of family business which I had to take care of in Europe. It was some of my happiest times. But then, the US has changed a lot since we left.

This may understandably not be the route you will be able to take. I do however believe that, as long you do not expect the miracle of being legalized because of your talents (which is not to say it can't happen), you can "go under" and spend a rewarding 3 months or so exploring the US music scene and even participate (even while not very legally). I would not be surprised that it could soon be an adventure which may take you out of Nashville to "who knows where". But if you indeed have the 10K to support yourself and manage to stay away from trouble, trouble makers and compulsive losers you should have at least a great and musically rewarding time.
You will have to understand that playing jobs around cities are often tied to union affiliation, something which is not available to you and that even people who smile to you and invite you to beers, may turn around an rat on you if they suspect you are taking anything away from you.

Finally, let's not forget life stories like PSG genius Neil Flanz's. He came from Canada and and started out in Nashville only with his talent... don't think he even had your 10 grand and somehow, he made it and now, decades later still plays his heart out in... Texas.

Just a few tips:
- Bring your cash (you can bring up to USD 9999.00 without having to declare it when entering the US.. don't try anything funny or you will start on the wrong foot!)in traveler checks... USD 100.oo's. Once there, OPEN A BANK ACCOUNT and deposit your money in it and get a Visa or Master Card-checking card to that account. You will not live at the finest addresses and places which attract a lot of wandering talent are full with those who's only talent it is to pray on them!
- Try to get an non-working Social Security number and a driver's license (not possible anymore in some States since 9-11... I don't know about TN). A driver license is the most commonly used form of ID in the US, you want one!
- Do NOT drink... if possible at all. Stay out of fights and arguments... bad night life is the #1 way to become known to local police or the sheriff's office in a bad way... you do not want that.
If you think some drugs are OK now and then. DO NOT GO to the US!
- Try to find church and other day playing jobs over tour and honkytonk jobs. Play at veteran's clubs like Moose Lodges and so forth... you will get to meet people which may indeed be able to help you in your quest to become a legal resident alien.
- Try to make friends with older people, this is the South, connections rule... older people have more connections and if you you appear a clean cut young talented person, they may prove helpful to you.
- Keep a clean and professional appearance at times... better skip a meal than not to look sharp and clean.
- If you feel that you are getting on quick sand anyway... LEAVE before you are in deep ... well, you know what.
- If you haven't hit gold by the end of your 90 days, go home and take it as a great experience to remember. Don't become a illegal.

I wish you luck but you will have to take it in you own hands... day and night.

... J-D.

Tomi Graso · Post by **Tomi Graso** » 29 Aug 2008 5:32 am

Hi Jamie,

Best of luck to you for going to Nashville !!!

Tomi………steel

Sydney / Australia

Tommy R. Butler · Post by **Tommy R. Butler** » 29 Aug 2008 7:40 am

Ken Byng wrote:
Tommy R. Butler wrote:
Damir Besic wrote:there is ONE good thing about Nashville that I know for sure, it is the best place to find a kick a$$ deals on instruments at the pawn shops... $:\$

Db

AMEN TO THAT. I just bought a PP Emmons for $300
Damir & Tommy

I asked a taxi driver to take me a pawn shop in Nashville earlier this year. He mistakenly thought I said a PORN shop. Must have been my accent. When I did eventually visit a couple, the owners knew the value of every musical instrument that they had. A push pull for $300??? Someone must have been starving to let a guitar go for that money. Mr Seymour would surely have paid more than that for it.

Jamie will find that accommodation, transportation and food is far cheaper than it is in the UK. The biggest thing that he will have to work on is networking. Lloyd Green found this when he first got into the recording business.

Porn instead of pawn LOL thats funny. Like most everthing else in this country most of the taxi drivers cant speak or understand English cause they arent Americans.

Guess Mr. Seymour missed a good deal then. Yep $300 bucks. I bought a Session 400 for $149 as well. I bought a Tele in a new leather case for $200. ANd The List Goes On.

Dont let anybody fool you. Yeah you can move here and find work but it comes with a price and sacrifice. Did anybody tell you that ??? Its like a business marketing yourself and being available. Very few come to town and just fall right into a dream gig but alot sure come to town thinking they will. Thats what keeps the dream alive and there is always two sides to every coin.

Everybody thats serious and can play needs to try it !!!! Aint nothing like it !!!

Rob Haines · Post by **Rob Haines** » 29 Aug 2008 7:55 am

This has turning into an interesting thread. I guess now it's about advice to anyone thinking about moving to Nashville, not just Jamie.

I moved here 26 years ago. Things have really changed. It's getting harder and harder for most musicians to make a living. I know plenty of awesome pickers that tried it for a while, got frustrated and split town.

The bad news - So many musicians keep coming to Nashville, lots of young talented pickers, and it seems like there's more and more every year. So there's a ton of great established players and then new hot pickers that will do anything to try to get established. There's not near enough jobs to go around. So now you see players on lower broad playing for just about free.

The good news - There is a lot of opportunity to do things in the industry, not just pickin. When you move here do everything you can to further your playing career. But at the same time look for things/jobs to do in the daytime that are in the music industry and can pay the rent. These can both help each other. I know a lot of great established players that now have day jobs, doing repair work, song writing, studio engineer, etc.

Special advice - Don't settle to be just a side man. Start your own band. Come up with something different. Or marry a singer and be her band leader. Or learn to sing and be the frontman. Or do what I did, marry a nurse

Joke for the day. What do you call a single nashville musician?
Answer - "homeless"

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 29 Aug 2008 8:51 am

i constantly hear about these clubs in nashville where paul franklin, john hughey, etc. play for free practically. to me, this sounds like the ultimate disrespect for musicians and music...in a town that you would think knows better and would be in support of the industry that feeds it. just because you can get away with this 'making people play for free' bull doesn't make it right. i am quite sure these clubs can afford to pay at least a reasonable fee, but don't because they don't 'have to'...indicating to me complete abusive disrespect to the artists that give their crappy little bars any credibility in the first place! %@$# them!

Joe Stoebenau · Post by **Joe Stoebenau** » 29 Aug 2008 9:11 am

chris ivey wrote: just because you can get away with this 'making people play for free' bull doesn't make it right. i am quite sure these clubs can afford to pay at least a reasonable fee, but don't because they don't 'have to'...indicating to me complete abusive disrespect to the artists that give their crappy little bars any credibility in the first place! %@$# them!

I agree Chris.
I was living in Hollywood from the mid 80's until 2000 and that was a great time and place to be a guitar player. (that is until grunge came on the scene and killed heavy metal) The only problem was that even the guys living on the streets had a guitar and could play "Eruption". There were so many good players and they all wanted to make it big in the metal scene that none of the clubs paid bands.
Supply and demand I suppose. If the band will play for free thinking there is a chance that someone who can get them a record deal will see them, why pay them? I'm not sure if it is still like today but the music is different as well.

Jerry Roller · Post by **Jerry Roller** » 29 Aug 2008 9:42 am

Look what Pete Drake did. He hit town with a new catchy style and did great as a session player which I think is the best paying avenue in Nashville.
Jerry

John Roche · Post by **John Roche** » 29 Aug 2008 9:51 am

Maybe it is better to be a BIG fish in a small pond
not a small fish in a BIG pond..
The way the world is a the moment with jobs closing down and folks not spending, it will be a tough road and if you got family it's going to be even harder.
Jamie if you are set on this venture and your family are behind you good luck lad....

John Steele · Post by **John Steele** » 29 Aug 2008 10:10 am

Best of luck with that, Jamie. I agree that you'll wonder "what if" if you don't go for it. Having said that...
Regarding the comment from well-meaning people who say "You should be in Nashville..."
I hear people say that alot, sometimes to me and sometimes to others. Very few if any of them know anything whatsoever about what goes on in Nashville.
Last time I heard it was while I was getting off the stage at a fairly-paid gig up here in NowhereVille.
I couldn't respond, because all I could think of as I stuffed the money in my pocket were the Nashville guys I know who are working for tips, who could smoke me with one hand tied behind their back.
More than anything, have a good time with it, and embrace the experience.
-John

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 29 Aug 2008 10:58 am

Rob Haines speaks the truth.

Jamie Lennon · Post by **Jamie Lennon** » 30 Aug 2008 1:42 am

Well I wont be homeless !

Scott Shipley · Post by **Scott Shipley** » 30 Aug 2008 2:56 am

All good advice.
Remember that not all sacrifices are monetary.
Tommy found those deals in pawn shops there because another musician who came to town with dreams and connections found himself not as connected as he thought......
Before I moved to Nashville I used to say it takes b@lls to move to Nashville. Now I say it takes bigger b@lls to stay.
Not to be discouraging Jamie, just bein honest with you. Go for it!

Johan Jansen · Post by **Johan Jansen** » 30 Aug 2008 6:19 am

Go for it, Jamie.
I wish I had done that 30 years ago....

Ron ! · Post by **Ron !** » 30 Aug 2008 8:05 am

Man you're that old already Johan?

Johan Jansen · Post by **Johan Jansen** » 30 Aug 2008 10:26 am

as old as a chevy 57

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 30 Aug 2008 10:35 am

johan...in our country we call that a '57 chevy!!

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 30 Aug 2008 12:12 pm

How to get a gig in Nashville.
Good luck, Jamie. Stop by and see me at the Long Hollow Jamboree some Thursday when you get here.

Jamie Lennon · Post by **Jamie Lennon** » 31 Aug 2008 4:12 am

Will do Cal, gonna go over in March also, for a holiday for a week.

Thanks

Joe Alterio · Post by **Joe Alterio** » 31 Aug 2008 5:19 am

Terry Wendt wrote a really good book about breaking into Nashville a few years ago....the book has its own website: www.theearlydays.com

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 1 Sep 2008 8:29 pm

Jamie,

I moved to Nashville when I was 20 with about 2 years total music experience (all on the pedal steel), and I've never regretted it. I did it with a whole lot less resources than you (I might have had $500 as a backup).I think it's great for you to give it as a try on a periodic basis, and you can't do better than having somebody like Theresa at your back.

One thing that you might consider: in terms of a long term music career, you'll probably do best in the long term by writing music, and working on your own material (and forming a band focused around your vision). Working as a side man in Nashville is a great experience, but working for 10 years playing somebody else's licks isn't going to give you any more experience than doing it for a year.

IMHO.

John Davis · Post by **John Davis** » 2 Sep 2008 12:54 am

Jamie, I would like to add my best wishes for your success over there, you will love it I`m sure the people are great they make you so welcome. In my experience it does`ent have to be Nashville the USA is full of great places for a steel guitar player.
Only advice I can give is Wendy`s does the best burger IMHO nothing else comes close.
In return for this priceless information, would you please give my phone number to the people you are currently playing for

us Brit players have to eat too!.........JD

Jamie Lennon · Post by **Jamie Lennon** » 2 Sep 2008 4:30 am

John thats a deal !!!

I like Wendy's !!! But more of a rare steak man !!!

Scott Shipley · Post by **Scott Shipley** » 2 Sep 2008 4:36 am

Bailey and Cato's. Corner of Riverside and McGavock. Soul food meat and three.

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 2 Sep 2008 5:43 am

Scott Shipley wrote:Bailey and Cato's. Corner of Riverside and McGavock. Soul food meat and three.

Yeah!

The meat and three places in Nashville kept me alive (along with peanut butter) when I lived in Nashville. Especially during the winters when my only source of income was playing the Opry ($25 a show for 3 shows a week).

Here are some other words of advice from somebody who was in a similar position:

Jamie, you clearly have the talent (from your web site) and the drive (from your postings) to do well in Nashville or any other place. You will find people in Nashville who will support you and help you succeed. As a totally green player with much less on the ball than you I had support from players like Paul Franklin and Mike Smith, who were also struggling 20 somethings, as well as many more. I didn't meet a steel player in Nashville who wasn't welcoming to me (probably because I wasn't much of a threat).

With that said, the music biz is really tight in Nashville. The session business is *way* down, causing session players to compete for the prime road gigs. As a twenty something, you have a lot going for you in terms of appealing to your potential employers, but you will find real emnity from your older fellow musicians as the hot young kid on the block. Although Paul Franklin doesn't talk a lot about it, he faced some serious trash talking from competitors as he broke into the session business.

Because of this, I would be really careful about accepting any paid gig until you can get legal green card status. Even if 99% of the people you work with are supportive and welcoming, there will be the one guy who turns you in to the INS because he thinks you took the prime gig that he was anticipating.

One idea: Say you get an opportunity to do some gigs with an established or up and comming artist. Tell the artist that you would love to play, but don't have legal work status yet. Say you would love to sit it with them, and have them donate your pay to a charity of their choice. That way you aren't getting the gig (and putting somebody out of work) because you will work on the cheap, and you also will earn the respect of the people you are working with.