Springs on the pedal rods a good idea?

John Hof · From: Colorado, USA

Hi. I'm working over a Sho-Bud Pro II and, among other things, I need to raise it up at least a couple inches. Instead of the usual "extension nuts" I was thinking of adding springs between the pedals and the rods. They would be stiff enough that they would not stretch until the pedal lever hit its stop. It seems like this would particularly help when pushing multiple pedals (there would be some "give" at the bottom of which ever pedal hits its stop first). Does this sound like a good idea or not?? thanks much,
John
p.s. I'm new to the forum as well as the PSG but have played guitar and drums for many years.

richard burton · From: Britain

Definately not a good idea Sad

Bob Knight · From: Bowling Green KY

James Collett · From: San Dimas, CA

Not- it would eliminate any positive feel to a pedal, and once it bottoms out, will keep on going! Also, depending on how stiff the pull and how stiff the spring, you might never hit the stop.
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James Collett

Martin Weenick · From: Lecanto, FL, USA

Definetly no, get a kit and be done with it. They are not expensive.
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Several custom steels. NV-112 Boss DD-7

John Hof · From: Colorado, USA

Thanks guys. No ambiguity here. I appreciate the help,
John

Jon Light (deceased) · From: Saugerties, NY

Good job, John. This is not a matter of entrenched thinking. It's a matter of people knowing what they're talking about. A little bit down the road you will see why your idea would compromise the workings and feel of the instrument.

David Wren · From: Placerville, California, USA

John, if you want to see what this would feel like, without actually adding the springs... set up your steel on the front lawn, or a carpet with a really deep pile..... when the feet of the legs sink down, the grass or carpet will push up under the bottom of the pedals.... one try will be quite convincing Smile

still.... it's a good thing to see folks still thinking of how to improve on this great instrument! Keep the fresh ideas coming!
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Dave Wren
'96 Carter U12,7X7; 1936 7 string National; Line 6 HX Stomp; Quilter TT-15/TB202; Quilter "Steelaire"; DV Mark "GH 250"with 15" 1501 BW; Boss "Katana" 100 Head w/Line 6 Cab; Telonics VP.

John Hof · From: Colorado, USA

Well, I'm compelled to reply. If the spring I'm talking about adding had about the same tension as the return spring on the fingers, then it would act much as you describe (a big spongy mess). But I'm talking about adding a spring that is stiff enough to not stretch (at all) until the pedal hits its stop. Thus, you would not feel the added spring during normal pedal travel at all. You would only feel it at the bottom. The advantage would be when depressing multiple pedals--they wouldn't have to hit their stops exactly at the same time, because the new spring would allow a little more travel for whichever pedal hits its stop first (at much higher tension). Look, I absolutely believe that this is not a good idea, I just needed to clarify. Thanks again and sorry for the trouble,
John

Ronnie Boettcher · From: Brunswick Ohio, USA

I'd make longer rods, or make extensions to the rods, with rod couplings, and long screws, the same thread size as what you have. Just cut the screw heads off so all you have is threaded rod. then screw that into the coupling and the original rod. That way, you can go back to the original size if you want to, by just removing the couplings and the extension pieces.
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Sho-Bud LDG, Martin D28, Ome trilogy 5 string banjo, Ibanez 4-string bass, dobro, fiddle, and a tubal cain. Life Member of AFM local 142

C Dixon · From: Duluth, GA USA

"Don' wan' no sprangs inahwhur between dat' pedul and dat' strang. Ceptin da strang itself."

The second PSG I bought was a '69 Emmons' P/P. So the two happiest times in my life (when it came to music) was the day I bought that guitar and the day I sold it. I kept it almost 20 yrs. I hated that springy feel from day one. This was exacerbated when we began lowering strings that were also raised. Like pedals 5 and 8. Or when they began lowering strings 5 and 6, etc.

While it did not have springs in the pedal rods, it did have "shock" springs in the pullrods. Which ARE necessary. NEVAH again for me. For those that don't mind it, that is fine. To each his own.

It is one of the reasons very few PSG manufacturers build a P/P today. Emmons' says they have reintroduced the P/P, in a Single neck version only. Wonder why they do not offer it in a D-10?

Sound is important indeed on a musical instrument, and I still believe the P/P Emmons has the best sound of any PSG ever built, but sound is not the only thing that is important. I believe mechanics plays a much larger role IMO, than many realize.

I will take a lessor "sound" PSG (any day) with positive feel pedals and knee levers, than the other way around.

If you have ever gotten somewhat used to a "Spring loaded" PSG, and you sit down to a Mullen, or Emmons' All/Pull, or other such "positive train" pull PSG's. etc, you will feel instantly why most do not want ANY "spongyness" in the pulls, except of course in the string itself.

Now what did I do with that flame retarder. Whoa!

c.
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A broken heart + † = a new heart.

John Hof · From: Colorado, USA

I ended up doing what Ronnie suggested (except I used threaded rod). This allowed for a 2 3/4 inch lift ( I'm 6'3" with a 15D foot). Thanks again everyone, for saving me from myself,
John

Jim Bob Sedgwick · From: Clinton, Missouri USA

Carl, glad to see you back. No one will flame a person who speaks the truth, and you nailed it on this one IMO Smile

Ronnie Boettcher · From: Brunswick Ohio, USA

Hi. Glad you did it. I was going to say get some threaded rod, but I figured you could find 3 or 4 inch screws easier. Good luck, and it will work just fine.
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Sho-Bud LDG, Martin D28, Ome trilogy 5 string banjo, Ibanez 4-string bass, dobro, fiddle, and a tubal cain. Life Member of AFM local 142

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