GFI players,..come on in...Again (New vid, pg. 4- 4/25/10)

Instruments, mechanical issues, copedents, techniques, etc.

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Jeff Harbour
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Post by Jeff Harbour »

Dale,

Here's an update. I have installed all of my washers and am restringing as I write this. I apologize for the misinformation, but I should've been looking at my steel before listing my problems. The string going flat is actually the low G#, and it was being caused to go flat with the A pedal. I was mistaken because I was only noticing it while checking the tuning of the F-lever/A-pedal chord.

It's going about 5 cents flat and I believe the cause is the 5th & 6th string tuning key spindles touching, so this is probably something other GFI players will experience due to the close-proximity design. The bad thing is I have no idea what to do! I'm going to try wedging a small screwdriver between them and applying a little pressure while tightening the string. If that doesn't work I'll have to tune that string a bit sharp to compensate.

Has anybody else had this problem?

Jeff
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

Jeff,
Whoa! hold on there. Don't go wedging a screwdriver, or anything between those peg posts. That ain't the problem. You're gonna bust something that way. They aren't going to move either, because they're locked in with a nut on the inside. Nothing is gonna give. You'll bust a post, or your screwdriver, and even if you did get lucky enough to move something, theres gonna be damage, and it won't help a bit. The posts for strings 5,and 6 are like that intentionally. Even if they do touch, they still operate independently, and one has nothing to do with the other. They are, in fact, that close for the purpose of alignment of the string to the roller, and on down to the changer. You need to have a nice clean, straight line from the changer all the way to the peg. Think of that roller as just a relay. If you have a sharp angle between the roller and the peg post, you're gonna have trouble. In other words, you already have a straight line between the changer and the roller. Does it "dogleg" from the roller, over to the peg post? That might be causing your problem. The string could be binding up on the roller.


I'm trying to upload a pic of my keyhead, but keep getting an error message. Check back after a while, I'll talk to Wiz, and see if we can work it out.
Last edited by Dale Hansen on 19 May 2008 5:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

nt
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Richard Damron
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Post by Richard Damron »

Dale -

Yeah - I know - we only live a few miles from each other and I DO have your phone number but I thought I'd post this on the Forum in order to help keep this thread alive. IMHO it is needed.

Went to Charles Tilley's site and listened to "...New Orleans". Mighty FINE, son! By the way - where did you get the backing track?

I have a problem - minor I hope. The "A" pedal raise is not as smoooooooth as I think it should be. It doesn't have a glitch or hesitation but, rather, it seems to be non-linear - to raise MORE during the first part of the travel. Makes the "1/2 A raise" a little dicey and hit or miss. That, coupled with my uncalibrated left foot, sorta makes me cringe whenever I'm forced to use it. Does a simple fix come to mind? 'Preciate any help you can offer.

Planning to see you soon. Thoroughly enjoyed my first visit.

Respectfully,

Richard
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

nt
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Jeff Harbour
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Post by Jeff Harbour »

Dale,
All is good now. I didn't do a thing until I got the new strings on, and the new ones play much better! I don't know if it was the brand, gauge, or just a dud of a string, but it's much better. I'll put another post if the problem pops back up.

Thanks again,

Jeff
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Dale Hansen
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Photo upload (mal)function

Post by Dale Hansen »

nt
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Jeff Harbour
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Post by Jeff Harbour »

I hope we don't have that law! They might put a raid on the next OSGA jam!

Anyway, I forgot to mention the washers. Amazing! You won't notice just what difference the free-ness of the rods makes until you get rid of it. Thanks again.

Jeff
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Dale Hansen
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Mod Pic's Here

Post by Dale Hansen »

Glad you did the mod, and like the results Jeff.
I also gotta say,.. you can take a "wedgie" pretty well too.

A good, well developed sense of humor is one of the best assets we can ever hope to have, and lean on through the rough patches in life......according to my court appointed psychiatrist.
Last edited by Dale Hansen on 26 Apr 2010 1:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Steve Norman
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Post by Steve Norman »

these mods sure make this thing smooth,,thanks!
GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS
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Dale Hansen
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nt
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Dale Hansen
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Another nugget?

Post by Dale Hansen »

.
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Russ Wever
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Post by Russ Wever »

Dale,
Is this another mod?
Image
Looks like something
metallic crimped around
the Bellcrank?
~Russ
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

Howdy Russ,

To answer your question, yes...sort of.
That was done a few months ago while I was swapping the levers on strings 3 & 4 on the 6th neck. That particular one was still a little too loose, and showing a slight amount of wear against the bellcrank where that rod was rubbing. What you see there is two layers of aluminum foil tape. It helped to shim the rod out away from the crank and take up some of the remaining slack from the flange side, where the nylon washer is. The aluminum foil is also softer than the steel in the bellcrank, so it buffered the contact points and still allowed it to move freely.
Later, I spotted another crank that was showing some signs of distress from a rod that was connected further down line, but moving right up against it.
I am using the Velcro (fuzzy part) to buffer all of these points now.
Get the real "Velcro" brand name (adhesive backed) if you're planning to do this to yours. The adhesive is much better than the off brands, and the "fuzz" is better quality too. Use some acetone on a Q-tip to clean the surface before you apply the 1/8 - 3/16ths strips.

Image
Above, you can see where two other passing rods contact the closest bellcrank. The velcro buffer will eliminate the clacking noise, and wear.

I'd imagine you might wonder about this too.
The two tiny zip ties you see here are at about the mid point of the guitar. (5th pedal rod) The longest rods you will have are for the (E9th) 5th, and 10th strings going to the "A" pedal. The bellcranks you see below are for the vertical lever 5th, and 10th lowers.
These ties are not tight enough to pinch the rod, but simply contain them lightly, and direct the pull a little better. They are placed between the unused holes in those cranks where the rods naturally want to hang.
Image

I mentioned doing some work on the knees on another thread. I'll go ahead and elaborate more here, and now.
On the "stock" GFI's, they feature a stack of washers (3) to space the lever away from the crank. They are steel on steel, and will get loose, and sloppy over time, and will create wear eventually as well. In the photo below, you can see how I sandwiched one of the original washers between some larger nylon washers. These aren't the same washers normally used on the bellcranks. They are about nickle sized in diameter, and about 1/16th in thickness.
That is RKR pictured below. After re-assembling the thing, I cranked it up tight at the nut, and hex screw (through the brass fitting) I in fact overtightened it, to where it would hardly budge at all. Then, I slowly backed the nut off until it just barely moved freely, and then backed it off a hair more.
Now, the assembly is all tight and firm, but moving very easily.
The main rule of thumb is if anything is even slightly sloppy, tighten it up, or it will cause abnormal, premature wear. You can still do the crank up procedure mentioned above using the original metal washers, but you might want to add a drop of the blue loctite at the nut. The reason I used the 1/16 thick nylon washers was for compression, and wear resistance.
Image
Look closely at the farthest lever. Now directly below it you'll see the black screw head, left of it, the large brass fitting, more left, the lever assembly, and the two white nylon washers with one metal original in between them.

A closer view
Image
Last edited by Dale Hansen on 11 Apr 2010 3:16 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

I did forget to mention one thing...
It's a simple reminder to not neglect the nuts inside of the key-head. You'll need a 10mm open/box combo wrench for these nuts. You can get one at Lowe's, Home Depot, or from any hardware store.

These thin nuts don't have very much thread on em', so they tend to loosen up over time, and can rob sustain, and cause inconsistent tuning returns - bad enough to give you 'fits' if they're not checked periodically. I like to check them at every string change.
When the strings are off the pegs, you can see, and feel whether they wiggle around or not. Even if they don't feel loose, try giving them a snug.

Image
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Dale Hansen
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EZ Vertical lever customizing, while you wait.

Post by Dale Hansen »

This morning, I replied to this thread. http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight=

Upon further consideration, I realized the possibility that someone else might be having difficulties with their current setup so, I thought this little fix might be a worthy addition to the other GFI tricks mentioned in here.
This is an easy remedy for an out of reach vertical lever.

Now, assuming that your guitar is already within the right general fit range for you to begin with, you still may be one of those fellas that are plumb out of adjustment room on the up/down allen screw, and would like a little more to work with.

Here's how to achieve it. (And yes, by the way, it'll still fit in the case just fine.)

Begin with a block of tight, good quality 1/2" plywood. A good set of dimensions for the block would be 2-3/4" long X 1-1/8" wide.
This is not a complicated operation, and you don't even need to dismantle the lever/rod assembly to get it back together.

Here's the stuff we're talking about right here.
The block of plywood, (Hardware from left to right)
The two original screws; first, a 1/2" panhead wood screw, and a 7/8" 8/32 machine screw.
Next, is what you'll need.
A #8 lock washer, a #8 flat washer (2), a 1/2" piece of 14 gauge copper wire, a 1" wood screw, and a 1-1/2" 8/32 panhead machine screw.
"Image
Take note of where I've pre marked the wood block. You'll mark, and pre-drill the holes with a 3/16" bit at 1/2" off of the leading edge of the wood block, and roughly centered (l to r) with the holes at
*1-9/16" apart.
(* Do measure the hole spread on your guitar, the wood screw hole may vary just a bit from one to another *)

The nearest edge will go next to the grey framestrap on the guitar, the arrow (on block) is pointing towards the changer end.
When you remove the original screws, the lever assembly will simply pivot upward for you to place the block underneath it. Put the new screws through the whole works, block and all, the machine screw will be on the right (keyhead) end. Place the lock washer on the machine screw first, followed by the flat washer, lever bracket, and wood block. Feel around to locate the threaded receiver for it, and give it just a few turns. Before you replace the new longer wood screw, you might want to add a 1/2" piece of 14 gauge copper wire to the old hole, to provide more "bite".
Now, use a #8 flat washer on the wood screw, and go through the lever bracket, the wood block, and locate the original hole.
Tighten it all up now, and proceed to the next step.


When it is all back together, and tight, you may need to loosen the rod screw on the bellcrank connected to the cross-shaft for the 5,& 10 lower, take up some slack, then re tighten it. You'll also need to re-adjust your lowers again at the nylon hex nuts (changer end)
In addition, you may also need to back off the allen stop behind the lever to give it a hair more travel.

Finished job.
Image
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Dale Hansen
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Get your "mod" parts here

Post by Dale Hansen »

I just received a bulk shipment of these nylon parts about a week ago. I've got enough for about 40 necks left.
I've sent out about 20% already.
This is a limited offer fellas, I most likely won't be ordering any more. (unless I'm feeling extraordinarily philanthropic later)
This is as easy as it's ever gonna get.
You can get the parts for the "mod" directly from me, instead off hunting them down yourself at Lowe's.
And you'll get em' a lot cheaper too. If you're even lucky enough to find enough at one Lowe's to do one neck, it'll cost you about $3.50, not to mention the time, and gas spent.


One stamp is enough postage. (I'll even pre-cut them for you) Refer to page 1 of this thread for the "how to's".
I'll also be available by phone, (see below) if you have any questions.
Once again guys, if you yourself, or someone you know owns one of these fine little GFI guitars, send em' over here. This "mod" will extend the life, quiet it down tremendously underneath, and truly, greatly improve the performance of it.


Just send a self addressed stamped envelope, along with $2 per neck to:
Dale Hansen
Bessdang Gizmos (optional)
2661 Long Hollow Pike
Hendersonville, TN 37075-8721

(615) 618 0776
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Dale Hansen
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VL lower kit

Post by Dale Hansen »

I've decided to go ahead and make these drop kits available too, for any other GFI'ers who'd like to drop their VL down a bit.
I went ahead and cut some blocks to size, pre- drilled em' and gathered up the required replacement hardware. I wrote up a tute sheet for the procedure as well. The post above might be of some help too.

The same deal goes for these, as with the nylon "mods".
Just send a self addressed stamped envelope, armed with at least *4 stamps to:


Dale Hansen
Bessdang Gizmos (optional)
2661 Long Hollow Pike
Hendersonville, TN 37075-8721

*(postage will run between about $1.50, and $2.00. USPS considers it more like a package, with the block inside it.)


I haven't set a price for these. If you would like to include a contribution to offset things, I'll gladly accept it.

Before you send off for one of these, please do flip er' over and measure these points, and include them with your request.
(I have oversized the drill holes enough to deal with slight variations from guitar to guitar.)
First, measure between the screws (center to center)holding down the lever assembly. It should be betweeen 1-3/8" to 1-5/8", the average being 1-9/16".
Second, measure from the center of the rear screw to the grey frame strap 7/16" to 9/16" is ok.
If I know your actual measurements, the more likely I'll be able to send you a block to fit.

(The measurements written in yellow, were the actual measurements on my own. Yours may vary a little bit, but that's ok, we'll deal with it.)
Image

(The good news is, the nylon washer "mod" kits, up to 2 necks worth are still fine with a single stamp within the U.S.)

Thanks again, DH
Kjell Ohlsson
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Post by Kjell Ohlsson »

Dale,
I´ve got difficulties in finding them nylon washers in Sweden.
Is it by any chance possible that you can ship to Sweden?
If so, how do I proceed?
I´ve got a wonderful candy blue GFI SD10.
Thanks
Kjell
Black Emmons L LGII D10 9+6,BOSS RV3, TubeFex, Fender Steel King, Hilton & Goodrich vol.ped, Fender 60th Anniversary Telecaster, Fender Twin Reverb 65 ReIssue, Volvo V70,
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

Kjell,

If you would drop me an email, or a PM with your address, I'll just send you what you need.
S-10 right?
Last edited by Dale Hansen on 16 Apr 2009 5:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kjell Ohlsson
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Post by Kjell Ohlsson »

Dale,
you´ve got mail !!
//Kjell
Black Emmons L LGII D10 9+6,BOSS RV3, TubeFex, Fender Steel King, Hilton & Goodrich vol.ped, Fender 60th Anniversary Telecaster, Fender Twin Reverb 65 ReIssue, Volvo V70,
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

Kjell,
Your stuff is on the way.(sent 7/11)
Yours too, Mr Bergh. (St. Paul, Minn)
It'll go out on Monday.

(earlier post)
This is a limited offer fellas, I most likely won't be ordering any more. (unless I'm feeling extraordinarily philanthropic later)

I actually knew that the above statement was a bunch of horse crap,...even as I was writing it.
Of course, I'll order more, if needed.
As of now, there are enough available kits for about 25 necks left from the first batch. All are already pre-cut.

Your pal, Dale
Kjell Ohlsson
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Post by Kjell Ohlsson »

Dale,
thanks a lot !
I´ll be sitting by the mailbox, patiently waiting for the mailman, in fact it´s a she, to show up.
From over the "lake" - have a nice day !
//Kjell
Black Emmons L LGII D10 9+6,BOSS RV3, TubeFex, Fender Steel King, Hilton & Goodrich vol.ped, Fender 60th Anniversary Telecaster, Fender Twin Reverb 65 ReIssue, Volvo V70,
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

Kjell,

At the post office, they said it would take 6 to 10 days to arrive, so you really don't need to start camping out until next Thursday, or Friday.
Don't forget to pack some snacks, bottled water, and a couple of changes of underwear.

What's really going on here?

You can't possibly get that excited about getting a few nylon washers.
She must be a real knockout. C'mon fess up. I'll bet that you sit there waiting for her every day anyway...... like a coiled serpent.

Now that's just plumb weird. Thats not the way we stalk an object of affection over here.

At least not for me. Last year, when I had a crush on my UPS girl, I was alot more dignified about it.
I'd stand on the roof, and watch for her to come down the street. When I finally saw her, I'd rattle my tambourine, and do a little jig dance in celebration of her arrival.
...Then I'd hurry down off of the roof before she saw me. (Click on link below, with volume up) http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/ff12 ... reck-1.flv


Of course, these days I'm much more mature, and don't engage in such nonsense.
(Not even without the restraining order.)
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Dale Hansen
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Post by Dale Hansen »

nt
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